Dear Mr. McKee,
Forgive me. I thought you had mentioned Bangkok in your previous post. As a teacher of English as a Second language for nearly 30 years, who has taught many people from the areas you have mentioned who have endured many horrible conditions and have made it to the US, I am not ignorant of the situation since I deal with the people who are directly affected and its consequences first-hand. I am sympathetic, empathetic and very much helpful to those who come before me from such circumstances. I have gone the extra mile in terms of my time, attention, energy, my personal pocketbook etc. for quite a long time. This I can tell you for sure; no matter where people may come from and what circumstances they have endured or what social standing they may have had in their country of origin, they are WELL aware that they will NEVER be me. (i.e. considered black in America). They make those distinctions even before they learn the language because they know they have come to an already racialized society in America (legacy of slavery) and do seek to curry favor and identify with the dominant group in America as soon as possible. Using the sympathies of people in this country to obtain resources and options unavailable to Americans of African descent, helps to perpetuate the continuing legacy of slavery and the stigma exclusion of African-Americans. You have made your position clear as to what concerns you and to what you are most sympathetic. That is fine. Also, it illustrates the crux of my concern about the intransigence of people refusing to examine this issue in America. Thanks, Wilma (This reply is to a post that I sent offline, but I have posted my rebuttal online since the response was posted to the list.) On 4/3/05 11:48 AM, "Jedidiah McKee" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Wilma, and others, > I wasn't talking about Thailand in my previous post. > I was talking about the tens of thousands of slaves > in the UNITED STATES, TODAY, which primarily come from > Eastern Europe, through Mexico. I find their > condition to be far more compelling than any other I > have heard about, whether present or past. Your > reaction leads me to believe that I was right to try > and enlighten people on this state of affairs, since > you appear to be ignorant of it. I am not making any > specific comments on slavery prior to the fall of the > Berlin Wall (1989?). > Jed McKee. > --- Wilma de Soto <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> Dear Mr. McKee, >> >> Thank you for your post about modern day slavery and >> prostitution trade in >> Thailand. >> >> However, you are equating that with the chattel >> slavery of Africans in >> America and a legal, constitutional societal >> framework written into the very >> fabric of this country whose effects linger to this >> day. >> >> Slavery of Africans in America was "The Peculiar >> Institution" as coined by >> Kenneth R. Stampp. It is not the same as what is >> going on in countries >> today. >> >> That is not to say that I feel no sympathy with what >> is occurring in the >> Sudan etc. I most certainly do. >> >> My concern is the continued intransigence of people >> in THIS country to >> examine the issue of the accumulation of wealth, >> access to resources and >> opportunity bequeathed to some members of our >> society through the legacy of >> slavery, and still denied to others. >> >> People do not have to look at other countries for >> the "real issue." >> >> Unfortunately for those in Southeast Asia, a lot of >> this is cultural. Women >> are not valued highly and many of those girls are >> sold into slavery by their >> parents in order to offset debts, etc. They are not >> stolen from their >> families and sold into slavery. >> >> In the Sudan, there is the continued oppression of >> those who are not Moslem >> by those who are. A key factor in the Middle Passage >> Slave trade as well. >> Wars, tribal conflicts etc. contribute to these >> terrible conditions. >> >> When the laws of those countries are changed so to >> that the same fate MUST >> be shared by future members of the same tribe and >> their progeny, as well as >> defining who is human under the law and who is not, >> THEN we will start to >> have a similar condition of slavery there as was >> here. >> >> Americans do not have to point fingers around the >> world and define the "real >> issue". They do so however in order to avoid coming >> to terms with >> injustices here in their own backyard and maintain >> their façade of innocence >> in the face of injustice, while being complicit in >> enjoying the benefits of >> NOT being the ones who are excluded. >> >> Thanks for listening. >> >> Wilma de Soto >> >> >> On 4/2/05 12:25 PM, "Jedidiah McKee" >> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >>> I'm thankful for the history lesson this string >> has >>> generated. However, slavery in modern times was >> also >>> mentioned, by Brian Siano, I believe. >>> >>> By some estimates, there are more slaves alive in >> the >>> world today than there have been at any point >> before >>> in history. Many of them are used in difficult >> &/or >>> dangerous mining or harvesting operations. There >> is >>> also the sex slave trade, of which many, if not >> most, >>> could be classified as children (since >> 21-year-olds >>> have more rights). This trade exploded with the >> fall >>> of the Berlin Wall, with poor and desperate people >>> trying to get out of Eastern Europe and into the >>> "golden West". Sex slavery in the West is >> different >>> than in the East; virginity is not the commodity >> in >>> Senator's sex toys in North America that it is in >>> Bangkok. By the time some CEO has paid $35,000 >> for a >>> slave, she has been systematically drugged, >> underfed, >>> beaten and raped repeatedly, until all she (or he) >> has >>> the energy to do is obey orders. It's scarcely >>> surprising that such a slave's working life is >> only >>> two years (and they're unlikely to live much >> longer), >>> and there are tens of thousands of more slaves >> being >>> taken every year. It is my belief that this >> practice >>> will only fade slowly, as simulacra and virtual >>> reality slowly reduce the demand, and as politics >>> reduce the supply. As it is now, there are too >> many >>> people in power who benefit fom it, both here in >> the >>> US and in Mexico, as well as the Eastern European >>> cartels that supply the slaves. >>> >>> So if you wanna stand up on your soapbox and work >> for >>> justice, I would start there. >>> >>> Jed McKee. >>> >>> PS Much of my specific info on this is from a >> January >>> 25, 2004 New York Times Sunday Magazine article, >> and >>> and interview on WHYY radio Fresh Aire program on >>> Monday of that week. (My specific dates may be a >>> little off, but they're close to that.) >>> >>> --- John Desmond <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>>> Salutations, gentlefolk, >>>> >>>> Mr. Siano mentioned sanctions against >> 'collaborators >>>> with the British during the >>>> Revolution'. The turth, however, is even >> stranger. >>>> >>>> Many Tories - King George III's partisans - had >>>> their property (including a good >>>> chunk of downtown Philly) confiscated during the >>>> revolution, and sold to finance >>>> the Continental war effort. In the Treaty of >> Paris >>>> (the US copy is in the >>>> American Philosophical Society library on 5th St) >> we >>>> promised to compensate >>>> them. Congress, however, never appropriated the >>>> money for this. >>>> >>>> Foward two hundred years or so, and in the >>>> Helms-somebody Act we insist that the >>>> Cubans must pay up for what they nationalized in >>>> '61. Of course the United >>>> Empire Loyalists (think Daughters of the American >>>> Revolution, turned inside out) >>>> have been keeping close track of the amounts due >>>> their ancestors, plus interest. >>>> >>>> Will a future Film Festival see a remake of >>>> "Passport to Pimlico" set in our >>>> neighborhood - but this time a documentary ? >>>> >>>> Yours, John Desmond >>>> >>>> ---- >>>> You are receiving this because you are subscribed >> to >>>> the >>>> list named "UnivCity." To unsubscribe or for >> archive >>>> information, see >>>> <http://www.purple.com/list.html>. >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> __________________________________ >>> Do you Yahoo!? >>> Yahoo! Personals - Better first dates. More second >> dates. >>> http://personals.yahoo.com >>> >>> ---- >>> You are receiving this because you are subscribed >> to the >>> list named "UnivCity." To unsubscribe or for >> archive information, see >> > === message truncated === > > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! Messenger > Show us what our next emoticon should look like. Join the fun. > http://www.advision.webevents.yahoo.com/emoticontest ---- You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named "UnivCity." To unsubscribe or for archive information, see <http://www.purple.com/list.html>.
