On 07/12/12 01:04, Steve Langasek wrote: > On Thu, Dec 06, 2012 at 04:39:00PM +0000, James Hunt wrote: >> I've attempted to distill what is becoming a rather difficult-to-follow >> discussion due to all the examples in the spec here: > >> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FoundationsTeam/Specs/RaringUpstartUserSessions#Collision_Resolution > >> Please update if you spot problems. > > The table here is very confusing to me with its references to "system > files". Is this /etc/init, or /etc/xdg/upstart? Given the distinction > drawn between system and user files, I would have assumed it's /etc/init, > but your terminology table suggests it's /etc/xdg/upstart. The latter since these search resolution discussions only relate to Upstart running as a Session Init.
> >> Note that I've also updated the Terminology section and special-cased >> "System Directories and Files" such that they should be considered as >> "higher priority" than User Directories to allow sysadmins to control user >> jobs via overrides to some extent, as already discussed in this thread. > > I think that's exactly the opposite of what is being proposed in this > thread. ... which just goes to prove that this thread is indeed becoming confusing :-) > It's the user's file that should take precedence over the system > copy, not vice-versa. Steve Langasek <[email protected]> wrote: > - change the packaged job behavior for all users on your system as part of > a site policy: /etc/xdg/xdg/upstart/foo.override Just so we are all clear, the current design means that "site policy" is not enforceable (*) since the user can create a foo.override and "block" the site policy file /etc/xdg/xdg/upstart/foo.override from applying. > >> I totally agree that we want to avoid user confusion. Therefore, I think >> that along with strong documentation, we should update init-checkconf(8) >> to run something like 'init --user --list-jobs' which will not run a >> Session Init, but which will print: > >> - each directory it is searching. >> - each file it finds. >> - whether the file will be considered or not based on either implicit XDG >> paths, or --confdir ones. > >> Thus allowing a user/admin to make sense of what is happening. > > Sounds like a reasonable debugging aid. I think it would be readable to > only report on the files that are actually used, though, and ignore those > that are being masked out. > >> I agree that ~/.init should be considered last. _Please_ feel free to >> update the spec if you notice problems - it's a working document for all >> to contribute to :-). > > I don't currently see the proposed search path specified anywhere in this > document. Should this be under > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FoundationsTeam/Specs/RaringUpstartUserSessions#Configuration_Files_for_User_Jobs > ? > >> Steve - I'm not clear on whether you're suggesting we need to consider >> perhaps a "/usr/share/upstart/conf/" too (a la initramfs-tools in Ubuntu?) > > Yes, I am proposing that. > >> Regarding allowing multiple --confdir invocations on the command-line, I >> really would prefer we have this - it's just exposing the internal search >> path logic, shouldn't be difficult to implement and would be invaluable >> for (non-DEP-8) testing in my view. > > That means there would be two *different* mechanisms for specifying a series > of config dirs, with different semantics: one by adjusting the contents of > $XDG_CONFIG_DIRS, the other by passing multiple --confdir options. I think > this is more flexibility than we really want to have to manage. The current design already includes two different mechanisms since we're proposing to add support for XDG_CONFIG_DIRS alongside --confdir, but I certainly don't want us to drop atleast being able to specify --confdir once, and that should have priority than any internal defaults and environment variable values. All we're saying is that by specifying multiple --confdir values, each one gets prepended to the internal list which will by default contain the values of the XDG_CONFIG_DIRS. This is a change to current behaviour in that currently only the last --confdir value is honoured, but adding Enhanced User Sessions to Upstart is a change to the current behaviour too :-) Cheers, James. (*) - well it technically still could almost be via 'typeset -r'/readonly shell tricks. -- James Hunt ____________________________________ Ubuntu Foundations Team, Canonical.
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