Dear Dan Thanks for the reply. Alas, I am one of those colleagues you describe, since the major part of what I want to do simply doesn't work well with rev.
Firstly, rev is far too slow for numerical computation. I did some tests and even byte-optimized Python beats rev for speed in most cases and that's hardly a "Gold Standard" for performance. Java, long lambasted for being slow, absolutely leaves rev in the dust as far as performance goes. Try doing a matrix inversion or sorting a huge list in both languages and you'll see what I mean. Granted, the Java development path is somehwat less fun than rev's, but Java is stable mature and truly cross (cross cross cross) platform if you use Swing components (Dan :-D) Now imagine you want to render some complex objects in 3D or visualize 2D or 3D data, both of which are things one might like to do even if you're not a geeky science coder like me (e.g. for games, financial analysis, GIS etc. etc.) All of this kind of stuff would be excruciating and impractical to code in rev unless ... (and here's my second major gripe with rev) ... you're willing to postpone your project for 6 months and write wrappers for a visualization DLL in C ... which is just what you wanted to avoid when you started using Transcript in the first place! With Java or Python, I import OpenGL or whatever visualization package I'm using and my workflow continues in my language of choice. I have access to the collective effort of thousands before me in a huge shared community of code. Java and Python may not be as much fun as rev, but they're like flying a plane compared to knuckle-walking in C. But as I said, I like Transcript and would like to see the evolution of rev steer more towards making the Transcript language really useful. So here's my wishlist for the good folks in Edinburgh ... 1. More comprehensive collection of datatypes (real arrays with ability to nest arrays etc.) 2. Much better performance (should also be enhanced by point 1) 3. Easier access to externals 4. A soild 2D vector graphics package And finally, inspired by Richard Gaskin's suggestion ... Compilation to Java bytecodes and integration of Java class libraries into rev ... Ooooh, you might have something there Richard ... Keep language you love, just swap interpreters (kind of like Jython) I like it :-D Best Gordon --- Dan Shafer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Gordon..... > > While I sympathize with some of your feelings (while > I continue to be > my most productive self when using Rev and grinning > from ear to ear > watching my colleagues who use Python, Java, and > Basic go through > excruciating pains to do what I can do in seconds or > minutes in my > favorite tool!), this notion of integrating > externals is one on which > I have pretty strong opinions. (Yes, I know. That's > unusual for me. NOT) > > The problem, IMNSHO, isn't with Rev, it's with the > fact that as far > as I know there is no single method of creating and > implementing > externals that runs on all platforms. I may be wrong > about that; DLLs > may in fact be more cross-platform than they were > last time I looked, > particularly with the emergence of OS X. But I am > pretty strongly > opposed to Rev spending significant time and > resources extending the > capabilities of the program for *any* > platform-specific > functionality. And, FWIW, that includes when they do > so for MY > favorite platform, OS X. I'd have been delighted to > see 2.6 fix a > bunch more bugs and not implement CoreImage and > DeepMask stuff. Now, > I realize that in saying that I'm in a small > minority and I also > realize that the DeepMask stuff works cross-platform > and will be a > real boon as Longhorn emerges from its near-decade > in cold storage. > But my position remains the same: of all the > development tools from > which I can choose, only two that I know of -- Rev > and Flash -- give > me true cross-platform capability. And because I > choose to work on a > minority platform but want to be able to reach the > majority platform, > cross-platform is my personal number one feature in > Rev. Anything > that detracts from that is just in my way or an > unnecessary appendage. > > So if there is a way to facilitate the incorporation > of cross- > platform external routines relatively transparently > and to give me a > Transcript-level way of dealing with them, I'm happy > to see it > implemented even though I have yet to need such > capability in the > dozens of things I've written. But if supporting > externals must be > done for a specific platform -- or, almost as badly, > differently for > each platform -- then I'm in favor of Rev passing on > that and fixing > more of the bugs we still have to work around. > > > On Jun 7, 2005, at 1:10 PM, Gordon Webster wrote: > > > still no real > > arrays, still no bridge to the vast world of > shared > > libraries that would allow me to integrate > external > > functionality into rev and save me having to > either > > reinvent the wheel or spend my time writing C > wrappers > > > > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Dan Shafer, Co-Chair > RevConWest '05 > June 17-18, 2005, Monterey, California > http://www.altuit.com/webs/altuit/RevConWest > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution@lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > _______________________________________________ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
