I'm glad to see renewed energy in the Accounting functionality. I have one request and will contribute related knowledge whenever possible.
Please consider multi-dimensional accounting in the design. The concept of "Internal Org" is a good start, although I am not sure that it's model could be extended for use with additional accounting dimensions. Here is what I can tell from the data model about how Internal Org appears to be used in postings: AcctgTrans contains a header record of the posting. AcctgTransEntry contains the debits and credits, and also stores the "organizationPartyId." So GL reporting by org can be done. To perform multidimensional accounting we must be able to track other dimensions at the debit and credit level (AcctgTransEntry.) This also suggests that the information be derived from sources higher up the stack, like an Invoice. Other systems I have worked on that have this capability store additional columns at the DR/CR level which implies that the number of available dimensions is fixed, not dynamic. This is usually OK. I haven't seen a company go beyond eight dimensions. But this approach definitely limits flexiibility. I have had conversations with others in the community on this topic. Some have suggested that we can derive the reporting from the source documents (Invoices, GL Journal, etc.) and do not need to carry lots of dimensions all the way to posting. But it sure makes reporting easier if we do. There are probably other compelling accounting reasons for storing the dimension with the posting but I'm no accountant. Vince Clark Global Era The Freedom of Open Source [EMAIL PROTECTED] (303) 493-6723 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Barrows" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: user@ofbiz.apache.org Sent: Friday, November 23, 2007 10:37:43 AM (GMT-0700) America/Denver Subject: Re: [OFBiz] Users - Accounting Extension (GL, etc) Now In Beta Sure, you can add me to the list. I'm a java developer in my day job. I'm learning the rest of OFBIZ. I'm also a team player, I can work on whatever we need to to get the job done. I had planned with starting on the most glaring omissions, the Income and balance sheet. But I haven't actually slung any code for it. On Nov 22, 2007 11:38 PM, Jacopo Cappellato <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi Jim, (and others interested in helping with the implementation of the > accounting component) > > can I add you to the list of "people interested" in this page: > > http://docs.ofbiz.org/display/OFBADMIN/New+Features+Roadmap+-+Draft > > ? > > If you (or others in this list) are willing to help with the > implementation I will do my best to help to organize the work in the > community (and also implement something). > > The main question to the ones interested are: > > - are there specific tasks you would like to work on? > - if not, we can help to assign/distribute tasks, but it would be useful > to know what is your area of expertise: tech (Java, minilang, > screen/form widgets, etc...) or business (OFBiz data model, existing > services, general AR/AP...) > > I've recently (yesterday and the day before it) I've cleaned up some > stuff in the accounting component (and implemented some new screens) and > now I have a clearer view of what is already available and what needs to > be done: now I'm sure that we can relatively quickly implement some good > stuff here with your help, so guys don't be shy!!! > > Jacopo > > > > > Jim Barrows wrote: > > Ok, so we still want to build this.. only better :) > > > > On Nov 20, 2007 5:12 PM, David E Jones <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> That is very old, and a lot has changed since then, including what > >> happened to this code base. All of the lower level stuff including the > >> data structures and GL posting services are part of OFBiz, but the > >> higher level things such as reports and automated posting mapping > >> services (from things like invoices, payments, inventory changes, etc) > >> are all part of the HPL licensed financials component from Open Source > >> Strategies, part of the opentaps distribution (semi-fork these days, > >> lots of stuff implemented that doesn't go back into OFBiz). > >> > >> For more information you should see their site at > >> opensourcestrategies.com. The HPL (Honest Public License) is a not an > >> OSI approved license and has some rather unpleasant terms in it, the > >> goal being to force contributions or purchase of a commercial license > >> (just like pretty much all "open source" companies that dual license, > >> usually with GPL though). The main thing with HPL is that if you make > >> it available over the internet it explicitly states that this is > >> public distribution of the software (for more details see the license > >> itself). > >> > >> In any case, that is why you're seeing discussion of implementing > >> these things even though there is an OFBiz add-on that has them, and > >> hence all of the references to another project that is licensed in > >> terms that make it hard to build a community around, and that can't be > >> included with OFBiz, etc. > >> > >> -David > >> > >> > >> > >> On Nov 20, 2007, at 4:54 PM, Jim Barrows wrote: > >> > >>> So what is the status? Do we have to pay for it? Is it done? i > >>> would think that in 2 years it would've gotten done by now. > >>> > >>> On Nov 20, 2007 4:48 PM, BJ Freeman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >>>> Here is and update from couple of years ago. > >>>> previously there was discussion about the frame work of this. > >>>> if I did all these out, is there a place on the documentation site we > >>>> can put them to save a lot of re discussion. > >>>> > >>>> David E. Jones sent the following on 9/23/2005 4:16 PM: > >>>>> Update: Accounting/GL Now in Beta Testing > >>>>> > >>>>> The Open For Business Accounting and General Ledger (GL) > >>>>> application is > >>>>> now moving into beta testing. Currently, it can support the > >>>>> accounting > >>>>> needs of most product-retail businesses that use Open For Business, > >>>>> including: > >>>>> > >>>>> * Support for multiple organizations and multiple currencies > >>>>> * Setting up chart of accounts with unlimited depth > >>>>> * General Ledger posting for most key business processes > >>>>> * Financial reports including trial balance, income statements, > >>>>> and > >>>>> balance sheets > >>>>> * Screens to create and manage both Accounts Receivable (AR) and > >>>>> Accounts Payable (AP) invoices and payments > >>>>> * Screens for managing tax liabilities across multiple > >>>>> jurisdictions > >>>>> * Administrative features such as periodic closings > >>>>> * Flexible entry and maintenance of payments and invoice > >>>>> (including > >>>>> application payments to invoices, etc) > >>>>> * Export to outside accounting applications (QBXML for > >>>>> QuickBooks is > >>>>> included) > >>>>> > >>>>> This application is fully integrated with the rest of OFBiz, > >>>>> including > >>>>> ecommerce, Point Of Sales, order manager, and facilities > >>>>> manager. It > >>>>> drops into your hot-deploy/ directory and runs right away. If > >>>>> you need > >>>>> other accounting-related features, such as payroll, it is fairly > >>>>> easy > >>>>> to develop a plug in for it. > >>>>> > >>>>> If you would like to learn more about the GL application, there is a > >>>>> video from the St. Louis Users' Conference > >>>>> (http://www.ofbiz.org/VideosConf.html) and an online demo > >>>>> (http://www.opensourcestrategies.com/ofbiz/demos.php). > >>>>> > >>>>> How to Make it Open Source > >>>>> > >>>>> The Accounting and General Ledger is developed under a community > >>>>> funding > >>>>> model. The idea is to get community funding to help cover the cost > >>>>> of > >>>>> developing a large, complex application. We think this is a very > >>>>> fair > >>>>> user-driven model because it can produce open source software with > >>>>> either a large number of small contributors or a small number of > >>>>> larger > >>>>> contributors. As an added incentive, those who contribute over > >>>>> $3,000 > >>>>> can begin to use the application immediately and benefit from all > >>>>> its > >>>>> features for a fraction of the cost of in-house development. > >>>>> > >>>>> We've currently received sponsorship for about half the development > >>>>> costs ($26,000 out of about $50,000) and require another $24,000 to > >>>>> reach our goal and release it under an open source license. This > >>>>> means > >>>>> that we can get there with just eight user-contributors with > >>>>> $3,000 each > >>>>> or, alternatively, a hundred contributors of under $250 each. > >>>>> > >>>>> -Si Chen > >>>>> -David E. Jones > >>>>> > >>>>> P.S. Special thanks to all who have contributed labor and funds to > >>>>> this > >>>>> effort, including: Open Source Strategies, Undersun Consulting, Ant > >>>>> Websystems, Masterfile Corp, and others. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>> Users mailing list > >>>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>>>> http://lists.ofbiz.org/mailman/listinfo/users > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> James A Barrows > >> > > > > > > > > > > -- James A Barrows
