This whole controversy regarding FIN_PAYMENT_DISC and VAT corrections led to (in B2B) to framework agreement conditions between supplier and customer about being credited for good payment performance over time, meaning that if and when during a period (quarter, half-year, year) the customer would pay on time, the supplier would send a credit invoice for a performance bonus, with VAT calculation. And that performance bonus would be (approximately) equal to the total FIN_PAYMENT_DISC discounts (and VAT amounts thereon) on invoices of that period.
Met vriendelijke groet, Pierre Smits *Proud* *contributor** of* Apache OFBiz <https://ofbiz.apache.org/> since 2008 (without privileges) Proud contributor to the ASF since 2006 *Apache Directory <https://directory.apache.org>, PMC Member* On Fri, Dec 3, 2021 at 12:30 PM Pierre Smits <pierresm...@apache.org> wrote: > Hi Ingo, > > First of all, FIN_PAYMENT_DISC, or Skonto rabat, as it is called in > Germany/Austria, is in essence a credit mechanism. > It is not a discount on price. Therefor subject to different fiscal rules > (regarding VAT) than just goods/services invoicing (I don't know how it is > in Germany/Austria and other EU countries), but here in the Netherlands > credit transactions are VAT exempt). > > If the organisation is following a different methodology (i.e. considering > FIN_PAYMENT_DISC not treating as VAT exempt), then he must ensure that > on the invoice (which states the terms) VAT amounts are stated for > both FIN_PAYMENT_TERM and FIN_PAYMENT_DISC. Corrections after the fact > (the invoice, a legal/fiscal document for both supplier and customer) > vis-a-vis VAT declarations is a path towards increased risk (fiscal audits, > etc.). > > Way back when I was working in retail (with both German suppliers and > Customers) responsible for accounting, we had the same issues over and over > again. Customers would subtract the discount, even after the deadline for > the term had passed, and assistants would register purchase invoices not > for the total invoice amount, but for the discounted amount (with VAT for > the full net amount) and those invoices would be paid also after the > discount term. We were regularly bombarded with overviews of unpaid parts > of invoices, and send the same out to our customers. Not only taking up a > lot of resources' time to follow up and correct, but also stressing the > relationship with customers and/or suppliers. > > We came up with a solution that alleviated both (time needed to follow up, > and stress reduction). We would take the VAT amount (regardless of the > FIN_PAYMENT_DISC) > stated on the invoice and register that in GL (for fiscal reporting), but > would write off the remainder of the invoice (after payment of invoice with > the FIN_PAYMENT_DISC deducted) and to a specific GL account. > > You can do the same in a custom function on the invoice: have a trigger > visible to the appropriate user constrained through: > > - Visible only when the FIN_PAYMENT_DISC is associated with the > invoice, and > - the amount to write off is equal to the calculated FIN_PAYMENT_DISC > amount > > And then have the function generating GL transaction and GL transaction > enttries for the write-off of the remainder of the invoice (in essence > marking the invoice as paid in full, for overviews, etc.) to the > appropriate GL accounts. > > Met vriendelijke groet, > > Pierre Smits > *Proud* *contributor** of* Apache OFBiz <https://ofbiz.apache.org/> since > 2008 (without privileges) > Proud contributor to the ASF since 2006 > > *Apache Directory <https://directory.apache.org>, PMC Member* > > > On Fri, Dec 3, 2021 at 11:13 AM Ingo Wolfmayr <ingo.wolfm...@wolfix.at> > wrote: > >> Hi Pierre, Hi Nicolas, >> >> just to be more precise: >> >> The order is completed and sent. The payment terms have been created via >> customer agreements and are shown on the invoice. The invoice have been >> sent. >> >> Not it's the customers turn. If he pays within the payment target, he can >> subtract the discount on the payment. >> >> On the bank account it shows € 98,- instead of € 100,- which is fine. >> >> The invoice needs a payment of 100% to be completed. Building the >> adjustment in vie manual accounting tansactions does solve the problem for >> the accounting, but not for the office staff working on the invoices. >> >> I guess I have to add the following functionallity: >> - adding this special invoice discount type after the invoice has been >> approved: this would enable the system to make the correct accounting >> transactions, add tax adjustments and the office staff will be able to >> complete the invoice + it can be easily used on reports. >> >> What do you think. Anything I missed? >> >> Best regards, >> Ingo >> >> >> >> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- >> Von: Pierre Smits <pierresm...@apache.org> >> Gesendet: Freitag, 3. Dezember 2021 09:55 >> An: user@ofbiz.apache.org >> Betreff: Re: Invoice - Discount >> >> Nicolas, >> Thanks for sharing your comments. >> >> Would you not agree that getting a payment for an order that hasn't been >> approved/processed (and the subsequent delivery not having taken place) and >> thus no invoice would be a bit atypical? An order adjustment (after the >> approval of the order) would then also be atypical... >> >> Met vriendelijke groet, >> >> Pierre Smits >> *Proud* *contributor** of* Apache OFBiz <https://ofbiz.apache.org/> since >> 2008 (without privileges) >> Proud contributor to the ASF since 2006 >> >> *Apache Directory <https://directory.apache.org>, PMC Member* >> >> >> On Fri, Dec 3, 2021 at 9:40 AM Pierre Smits <pierresm...@apache.org> >> wrote: >> >> > Gutentag Ingo, >> > >> > This is one of the payment terms, and should be reflected in >> > agreement, and order before it winds up in an invoice. >> > >> > Related term records can be found in data definitions for entity >> > TermType, and most probably applied are: >> > >> > - FIN_PAYMENT_TERM - for the standard >> > - FIN_PAYMENT_DISC - for the discount condition >> > >> > As for your use case (which is very common in German / Austrian >> > business), >> > >> > 1. the invoice can't be altered after it has been approved and >> > processed for posting to GL, >> > 2. the payment can't be altered after it has been received (as it >> also >> > needs to align with what is reported on bank statement, etc),and >> processed >> > for posting to GL >> > >> > Remains the outstanding balance of the invoice. With current >> > functionality, this needs to be manually adjusted in the GL >> > transaction regarding the payment association with the invoice. >> > >> > Met vriendelijke groet, >> > >> > Pierre Smits >> > *Proud* *contributor** of* Apache OFBiz <https://ofbiz.apache.org/> >> > since >> > 2008 (without privileges) >> > Proud contributor to the ASF since 2006 >> > >> > *Apache Directory <https://directory.apache.org>, PMC Member* >> > >> > >> > On Fri, Dec 3, 2021 at 8:49 AM Ingo Wolfmayr <ingo.wolfm...@wolfix.at> >> > wrote: >> > >> >> Hi everybody, >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I have an accounting question regarding discount on early payment. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> For example a customer has a payment target of 10 days. If he pays >> >> within those 10 days, he can subtract a discount of 2%. >> >> >> >> There is an invoice amount of € 100,- (the invoice is sent to the >> >> customer and therefore editing the invoice is disabled) >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> The customer pays € 98,- A payment is created and assigned to the >> >> invoice. The invoice says € 2,- open. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> How do I get the discount into the system? >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Best regards, >> >> Inog >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Mag. (FH) Ingo Wolfmayr >> >> >> >> *Wolfix Solutions* >> >> >> >> Gänsgasse 14 >> >> >> >> A-5282 Ranshofen >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Tel.: +43 (0) 664 2549626 >> >> >> >> Web: https://www.wolfix.at >> >> >> >> Xing: https://www.xing.com/profile/Ingo_Wolfmayr/ >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> [image: emailsignatur] >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >
