Dave Newton wrote the following on 7/2/2005 4:06 PM:
Gregory Seidman wrote:
On Sat, Jul 02, 2005 at 02:16:49AM +0200, Leon Rosenberg wrote:
} Heh, } } I hate this kind of discussion...
} } Maybe you are the fastest keyboard user on the world...
} } I want to see you refactoring a method, lets say change the method
name,
} with emacs/vi/notepad if there are about 20 other places in code
where this
} method is called. With an IDE it takes 1 second. With vi? 3 hours?
A) If you change the name of a method, especially by the time it's
referenced numerous places, you've already screwed up. It shows a lack
of forethought in your design (and I don't necessarily mean formal
design).
B) With appropriate unix tools (ed or perl, in this case), it's under a
minute. While that's more than one second, it should be an exceedingly
rare operation (see A).
} leon
--Greg
Ooo, I'll hafta disagree on both of these.
A) Renaming something to better describe its function isn't a crime or
bad design; sometimes it's just a by-product of an iterative design
process. Iterative design is pretty much the norm for quick turnaround
projects, especially web-based, because programmers have to work at
internet speed, not a sane "I get to design everything first" speed. I'm
pretty design-oriented, and reasonably good at it to boot, but I might
rename something 2-3x before I'm done with it, for various reasons.
These days I can do that trivially; in older days I might not have
bothered, and my recent code is the better for it.
+1 Which is why I think a good refactoring IDE is very useful (as do
many others) Not trying to continue the IDE wars, simply stating that
Greg you are wrong if you think that 'refactoring' means you are poor
designer.
B) It's WAY quicker and, more importantly, _safer_, to rename using an
IDE that knows about the underlying code than with sed/etc.
+1
No way this can be done more quickly or more *safely* using gawk,squak
or whatever and typing -frg fsh+1000 "*.dfjkj" %^%
As a side note, just noticed IDEA had a cool prompt when I was
refactoring a class name. Initially the name of the class was FooBarVO
and I realized I didn't want to have it named VO.. just want it FooBar.
Well the neat thing is FooBarVO extended BaseVO, and I got prompted if
not only did I want to change the superclass name but also all the other
subclass named WhateverVO.. it was smart enough to figure out that I
probably wanted to drop all the 'VO's off the subclass names.
Another factor that I know saves time using an IDE is .Completion. I
don't care how well you know the API of the project you are working on,
being able to type someInstance.(<--dot) and having the possible method
names now pop up is a HUGE time saver - you simply can't deny it.
Again I'm not huge fan of IDEs that get in your way, and if not for
.(dot) completion and refactoring, I don't see a 'tremendous' value for
them.
A good text editor is a must though and for those that care, you can set
up IDEA to use vim commands which is pretty cool. (I happen to like
jEdit for most of my work, although the latest UltraEdit looks really
nice and since I'm back on Windows I might shell out the small money for
that product since I really liked it back when I used to use it over
five years ago).
--
Rick
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