On Wed, Sep 16, 2015 at 10:53 PM,
<libreoffice-ml.mbou...@spamgourmet.com> wrote:
> Simos Xenitellis wrote:
>>
>> (obviously we are off-topic)
>>
>> On Wed, Sep 16, 2015 at 8:46 PM, <libreoffice-ml.mbou...@spamgourmet.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Tom Williams wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 09/15/2015 01:43 PM, libreoffice-ml.mbou...@spamgourmet.com wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Ady Ady wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hello Users of LibreOffice,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Once in a while I visit the Release Plan wiki page,
>>>>>> https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/ReleasePlan
>>>>>>
>>>>>> From that wiki page, I recently tried to visit the "5.0.2" -> "RC1"
>>>>>> page (more than once), but my OS hangs when I click on the relevant
>>>>>> link.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Of course, it could be just a coincidence. I am reluctant to try to
>>>>>> reach these pages again, especially considering that every new wiki
>>>>>> page in the series is based on the prior one.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am using Windows Vista Home Basic 32-bit, with Internet Explorer 9
>>>>>> and Mozilla Firefox 40.0.3, all updated.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The strange behavior happened with both web browsers.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I don't know whether some security tool being in use (e.g. Avast)
>>>>>> might be relevant.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I wanted to share this unusual experience, in case someone else
>>>>>> happens to see it too (or something similar, or at least uncommon),
>>>>>> and/or maybe it might be worth someone checking the source of these
>>>>>> wiki pages (and their related nested templates).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am aware that this behavior (hanging OS) would be considered
>>>>>> "unlikely to be triggered by some wiki page". The fact that it
>>>>>> happened to me more than once while following the same links (but
>>>>>> nowhere else) pushed me to at least comment on it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Interesting... I don't see a problem with that page at the moment.
>>>>> However, since mid July I have been experiencing occasional OS hangs
>>>>> which seem to be triggered by visiting certain web pages or sometimes
>>>>> scrolling down the page slightly even after it's been loaded for a
>>>>> while. Revisiting the same page doesn't necessarily trigger another
>>>>> hang, but some pages seem to be more prone to it than others.
>>>>>
>>>>> I use Windows Vista Business 32-bit, Mozilla SeaMonkey 2.33.1 (based
>>>>> on Firefox 36), Avast antivirus.
>>>>>
>>>>> One site (www.discount-electrical.co.uk) seemed to be particularly
>>>>> troublesome. At one point I couldn't even add a few items to the
>>>>> shopping cart and check out before the OS hung. Hangs seemed to be
>>>>> less frequent using Chrome instead, but I did still get a few. I
>>>>> didn't try IE.
>>>>>
>>>>> I haven't had so much trouble since mid August, but then again I
>>>>> haven't been visiting the sites which seemed to be triggering the
>>>>> problem so much lately either. Still get a couple of unexplained hangs
>>>>> a week though.
>>>>>
>>>>> I can't be certain that visiting the web sites is/was the trigger, or
>>>>> whether that's just coincidental. As you say, it does seem unlikely!
>>>>> If anything, I'd suspect some interaction with a Windows update or
>>>>> perhaps Flash or Avast, since I'd just got back from holiday and
>>>>> installed a load of updates just before the problems started. Another
>>>>> possibility for me is overheating or failing hardware (this is a 9
>>>>> year old laptop so getting on a bit!) but I haven't got around to
>>>>> investigating further.
>>>>>
>>>>> Mark.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> So, when the problem happens for you, what do you do to recover? How
>>>>> do
>>>>
>>>> you get the system working again? Have you checked the Windows Event
>>>> Viewer for log messages? There might be a log message around the time
>>>> the system hangs.
>>>>
>>>> Peace..
>>>>
>>>> "The Other" Tom
>>>>
>>>
>>> For me the whole OS completely hangs and I have to kill the power (press
>>> and hold power button for a few seconds). Ctrl+Alt+Del does nothing,
>>> mouse
>>> pointer doesn't move, and num lock / caps lock don't respond (they often
>>> at
>>> least toggle the keyboard lights even if nothing else responds; in this
>>> case even that stops responding).
>>>
>>> I haven't got around to investigating thoroughly, but things I have tried
>>> include:
>>> - Just leaving it for over half an hour to see if it would start
>>> responding again; it didn't.
>>> - Checking event logs; there's nothing obviously relevant, except the
>>> expected complaints during the next startup related to not having been
>>> shut
>>> down properly.
>>> - Keeping Task Manager / Sysinternals Process Explorer open before it
>>> hangs, but there's no obvious peak in processor or memory usage, or any
>>> particular process's activity - but they might just not get a chance to
>>> update the display when it does hang.
>>> - Some of the memory and CPU load tests from www.ultimatebootcd.com, but
>>> they didn't reveal anything and didn't hang.
>>>
>>> Can't actually remember whether I checked the disk for errors, I think I
>>> did but may be worth doing again.
>
>
> Just done that. No errors found by Windows' check disk, including checking
> for bad sectors.
>
>>>
>>> At some point when I have enough time I'll get the lid off and check
>>> fans,
>>> heatsinks, etc. I'm half expecting to find dust or spiders clogging
>>> things
>>> up...
>>>
>>>
>> The common thing with Ady is that you both have the Avast Antivirus. An
>> antivirus runs as a "system service" on Windows,
>> and if something goes terribly wrong in the system service, then the whole
>> operating system may misbehave.
>> Since you do not have yet a set of steps to reproduce the problem, it is
>> extremely difficult to figure out the issue.
>
>
> My reasons for initially suspecting Windows Updates were mainly the number
> of updates lately involving things such as fonts and graphics, and that an
> error introduced in a previous update (KB3013455) to Win32k.sys related to
> handling of fonts lead to some fonts being barely readable. It doesn't seem
> inconceivable that another duff update might occasionally hang the kernel
> when something (like a web browser) tries to display a certain combination
> of things, possibly with specific timing. I agree Avast is looking like
> another potential culprit.
>
> Another possible case... I was cleaning some junk off someone else's
> computer a couple of weeks ago, and they happened to mention that someone
> else had borrowed it to check emails (presumably webmail) and had it hang.
> Just a one-off as far as I know, possibly coincidental, but that was also
> Windows Vista with Avast antivirus.
>
> Not being able to reliably reproduce the hangs is somewhat frustrating. I'm
> not going to have time to look in great detail for at least a couple more
> weeks, but it does sound like there may be something in it. I think the
> first step will be to see if I can still get it to happen more often using
> the same sites I had trouble with before, though it varied between 5 minutes
> and several hours before a hang, possibly depending on things like exact
> usage patterns and what else happened to be going on in the background...
>
> Mark.
>
>
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Thank you all for your replies, feedback and tests.
My experience has been almost exactly as Mark wrote, except for one
thing: the whole OS hung _immediately_ when clicking on the relevant
link ("RC1").
Yes, I have been bitten by the recent MS Vista updates too (e.g. the
font degradation, then having to search and manually apply the
patch...).
At least 2 things in common: Vista and Avast. Unfortunately, I don't
have an alternative system available these days. Taking the risk of
damaging the stability of my OS (whether with Avast inactive or not)
is something that, unfortunately, I cannot do these days.
Whether there is a problem related to the wiki pages, or with Vista,
or with Avast, or no problem at all, I thought it was worth posting
it.
I _might_ be able to perform some additional attempts / tests at some
point in the near future. If I have something new to comment, or some
new observation from such tests, I'll be sharing it here in the Users
Mailing List. It might be considered off-topic, but, at least in my
case, I have only seen this *complete OS hang" behavior when visiting
the aforementioned wiki pages, and nowhere else. Maybe, just a
coincidence.
Thank you and Best Regards,
Ady.
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