Chris obviously has some kind of interface with the larger, corporate office environment. Even though there has been some movement, especially by some of the smaller office environments, to move towards "open" software, the fact remains that the BASE is still Microsoft! Windows, or whatever names you choose to call it, and the other Microsoft packages, are pretty much the corporate world de facto standards. I do not like that because that is one of the things that keeps the price of all M$ products up, and in many cases, out of reach for us home users. And all of the things that M$ is doing now is only hurting them. They are pricing and talking themselves out of the business. They are still using unfair business practices, and breaking most of the government directives that have been issued against them over the past 5 years or so. More and more people are realizing that, and that is the underlining reason that all the folks associated with the "open software movement" need to continue to work towards evolving their products towards the corporate office environment. And everyone associated with that movement needs to remember that the "WORLD" has been associated with some sort of Windows interface, AND other Microsoft products for over 25 years, or most of the life of mainstream computer products. Until the "open environment" products can overcome the "M$ WAY", it will continue that way. "Open environment" products definitely have the cost advantage, and are rapidly overcoming the "M$ WAY", but as Chris knows, they are not there yet. That is why it would make great sense for OO to include a very good PIM/Email client within the office suite. I have been using Outlook ever since it came out as a part of the business office suite. That usage started within a large corporation, but also made the decision for me as to what I would buy for home usage. No matter how much you dislike MS and their products, there is no product out there on the market that can replace the breadth of function, within one product interface, and within the standard corporate office Windows environment - Outlook. Evolution looks like, at least to me, a product that could possibly overcome Outlook, especially if it had a HELP file associated with it. I have installed it and tried to start using it, but there isn't ANY help with it. Or at least I haven't been able to get it to load any, and can't find any associated with it. So I have just stopped trying to use it - but it does look pretty nice. But this goes back to what the "open environment" has to do to overcome M$ - put out good products, that are usable. A good product without instructions on how to use is not usable! Just my 2 cents worth on this issue. Roxy Robinson
*********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 4/8/2007 at 9:43 AM Chris Cioffi wrote: On 4/6/07, Robert Smits <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Friday 06 April 2007 08:34, Chris Cioffi wrote: > > > Outlook is far more than just email. The Outlook/Exchange combination is > > something I haven't seen really replicated yet. The combination of Email, > > Calendar, Todo and Journal, even if individually lacking, combine into a > > very powerful tool. Especially the ability to *easily* schedule meeting > > and assign tasks. > > Outlook is a bug-ridden Windows product that introduces more viruses to its > users than any other email client. > Outlook is a major business application with more people being daily users that just about any other email/PIM product ever developed. The last couple of versions aren't too buggy, just showing their underlying design flaws. I can't argue the security issue. In no small part that's why I'm evaluating OOo and hoping that it comes out with a decent replacement for Office. > > So, given that Thunderbird is an inferior tool for serious business why > > would you promote it? And, given the glaring omission of a PIM in OOo > > right now, why should a business choose it? > > Lack of inclusion of a PIM in OO does not mean businesses don't have access to > a PIM. If they're using Linux, they already have PIMs. Well, OOo runs on far more than just Linux. And I still haven't seen a huge migration of corporate desktops to Linux. (Note: Now that Vista is out I suspect there might be, but XP still has a few years left in it.) > > > > Seriously, in a business setting users expect a full featured, integrated > > PIM like Outlook/Exchange. Yeah, Outlook sucks for email and it's not even > > close to the best for anything else it does, but it's a single tool and > > when integrated with Exchange it really does set a very high bar for > > overall functionality. Not everyone in an organization needs it, but guess > > what? The folks making the decisions do! And they aren't going to settle > > for a second rate solution. > > If they settle for Windows they already have. You haven't described anything > in Outlook that Kontact doesn't already deliver. Why waste all that time > reinventing the wheel? If all you're offering is another wheel why should I switch? And, of course, the question needs to be asked: if we don't want to waste time re-inventing the wheel why are there multiple PIMs for Linux? Why isn't there just 1 really good one? > > PS: Yes, I know that not all midsize+ organizations use Outlook/Exhange > > and that there are alternatives if you cobble together enough different > > tools. The fact remains that Outlook/Exchange is currently king of the hill > > in that space, and calling it just an email system ignores a significant > > part of it's value proposition. > > I'm not even sure it's "king of the hill" in Windows unless you mean more > people are deluded enough to use it. Lotus SmartSuite and Lotus Notes > provided that functionality to Windows and OS/2 users long ago, and did a > better job sooner. I've used both Outlook and Notes. While Notes _may_ have better functionality, it is just about the worst user experience I can possibly imagine. In fact, Lotus Notes offers a compelling case for going back to paper memos sent via interoffice mail. In the real world, software success is easily measured by the number of people using the product. Calling people deluded for using a product that meets their needs isn't likely to help your cause. Especially when by any reasonable measure your alternative is little more than a curiosity. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
