Bloat is all relative. Tapestry could dynamically assemble a virtual stylesheet for the page from bits and pieces, somewhat like JavaScript initialization is accomplished.
However, that would require encoding a lot of state information into the URL for the virtual stylesheet, and that would likely prevent the browser from caching it effectively. It also complicates the story when Ajax partial page updates come into play. I would rather we have a static stylesheet (and perhaps a static override to that stylesheet) that has a far-future expires header to encourage the browser to cache it. As everywhere, it is a tradeoff: you may see a first page load difference (more coming down than necessary) followed by very quick follow on pages (due to browser cache). If it is a top concern, you can copy the Tapestry default.css and use some configuration to override Tapestry to use your customized stylesheet instead of default.css. However, the contents of default.css and tapestry.js are in flux, more so than any other aspect of the framework, and fall into a grey area between stable public APIs and Tapestry internals. In other words, a moving target. It's very easy to lose sight of the forest for the trees; measure, measure, measure! Web applications have so many moving parts in so many different locations, so they are going to perform counter-intuitively. I use the YSlow plugin for FireBug and I'm working to make Tapestry applications automatically score well by those metrics: we've seen that in terms of moving the <script> elements to the bottom of the page, the removal of unnecessary whitespace and (in forthcoming releases) the automatic GZIP compression of replies and the minimalization of static JavaScript and CSS. I would suspect that the processing in the browser associated with CSS is relatively minor compared to the HTML, so if you can find a way to reduce the size and complexity of your HTML it's a bigger win than shaving a few lines of CSS. But measure! At Formos, we are planning to setup a performance lab to get some real numbers and points of reference. On Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 9:07 AM, Blower, Andy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > That's a really good point Peter. I'd be interested to hear what you think > about this Howard? > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Peter Stavrinides [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >> Sent: 03 September 2008 15:40 >> To: Tapestry users >> Subject: Re: Overriding Default Styles >> >> Yes, this much I know... and as I said before this is not ideal, and >> not very modular, it also means that I have to fiddle around with CSS >> inheritance which I loath to do as it can be time consuming, and one >> last point: bloating my pages with style sheets then more style sheets >> to cancel those out is not exactly a clean solution and it increases >> the size of my page. >> >> Thanks anyway, >> >> Peter >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Ulrich Stärk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> To: "Tapestry users" <users@tapestry.apache.org> >> Sent: Wednesday, 3 September, 2008 4:40:26 PM GMT +02:00 Athens, >> Beirut, Bucharest, Istanbul >> Subject: Re: Overriding Default Styles >> >> Hi Peter, >> >> As I said before, you can write a stylesheet that overrides the desired >> styles and include this everywhere you want to have the default styles >> being overriden by your custom style by including it either with >> renderSupport.addStylesheetLink() or with the @IncludeStylesheet >> annotation or by defining an asset and including it in your template. >> There you just override the desired styles. It might be necessary to >> use >> CSS' !important notation, though. >> >> Cheers, >> >> Uli >> >> Am Mi, 3.09.2008, 15:03, schrieb Peter Stavrinides: >> > Hi Ulrich, >> > >> > I am not sure exactly what you didn't understand, but what I meant is >> > this: Certain components such as the ones in the components project >> have >> > their own style sheet. Overriding these styles one by one everywhere >> I use >> > the component can be tedious, maybe I don't even want the styles to >> begin >> > with! >> > >> > Since these styles are linked in by the component using >> > RenderSupport.addStylesheetLink(asset, media), wouldn't it be great >> if I >> > could simply supply my own style sheet instead of the default style >> sheet >> > on a case by case basis? or perhaps override the style sheet in the >> > containing page? (hence: >> renderSupport_.overrideStylesheetLink(stylesheet, >> > media)) is this possible somehow at present? >> > >> > cheers, >> > Peter >> > >> > >> > >> > ----- Original Message ----- >> > From: "Ulrich Stärk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> > To: "Tapestry users" <users@tapestry.apache.org> >> > Sent: Wednesday, 3 September, 2008 1:25:24 PM GMT +02:00 Athens, >> Beirut, >> > Bucharest, Istanbul >> > Subject: Re: Overriding Default Styles >> > >> > I don't quite understand. A stylesheet is an asset and we already got >> > RenderSupport.addStylesheetLink(asset, media)... Just write your css, >> > create an asset and pass it to addStylesheetLink(). >> > >> > Uli >> > >> > Am Mi, 3.09.2008, 12:16, schrieb Peter Stavrinides: >> >> hmmm not ideal, especially for components, I was hoping there was >> >> something more along the lines of: >> >> renderSupport_.addStylesheetLink(stylesheet, media); >> >> >> >> or even better: >> >> renderSupport_.overrideStylesheetLink(stylesheet, media); >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> >> From: "Ulrich Stärk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> >> To: "Tapestry users" <users@tapestry.apache.org> >> >> Sent: Wednesday, 3 September, 2008 12:44:12 PM GMT +02:00 Athens, >> >> Beirut, >> >> Bucharest, Istanbul >> >> Subject: Re: Overriding Default Styles >> >> >> >> Tapestry's styles are included via default.css which can be found >> here: >> >> http://svn.apache.org/viewvc/tapestry/tapestry5/trunk/tapestry- >> core/src/main/resources/org/apache/tapestry5/default.css?view=markup >> >> Just include some css overriding those styles or change the >> >> configuration >> >> symbol tapestry.default-stylesheet to your own default stylesheet. >> >> >> >> Uli >> >> >> >> Am Mi, 3.09.2008, 11:27, schrieb Peter Stavrinides: >> >>> Hi >> >>> >> >>> I would like to know how to override Tapestry's default styles, >> >>> particularly: >> >>> >> >>> 1. Individual styles like validation error popups >> >>> 2. Component styles >> >>> >> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------- >> -- >> >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >>> For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >>> >> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -------------------------------------------------------------------- >> - >> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >> For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >> >> >> >> >> -------------------------------------------------------------------- >> - >> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >> For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >> >> >> >> > >> > >> > >> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> > >> > >> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> > >> > >> >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > -- Howard M. Lewis Ship Creator Apache Tapestry and Apache HiveMind --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
