On Wed, 13 Mar 2002 16:32:00 Jim Elwell wrote: ... >The perception of foreigners as to what the "average American" thinks about >metrication is pretty much meaningless.
? I don't think so, Jim. Why? Because it sets the stage for people's attitudes towards American policies. Unfortunately, like it or not, there IS a lot of anti-americanism around the world, and not only among arabs, BTW. Such perceptions (or misperceptions, if you disagree) do not help when it comes to external pressures for the US to metricate. Sure, we should love it, because Europe, for one, could continue insisting on passage of the metric directive, fall rain or hail, but I'd rather see a better spirit of cooperation and less confrontation among nations for the achievement of an allegedly common goal. > Good or bad, foreigners have very >little effect on US metrication policy, and don't vote in US elections. Nor >was I addressing that issue in my comments -- John, at least, is not a >foreigner. > Perhaps sadly so. And this is the kind of attitude that IMHO does not help America in the end, at least as far as getting their agenda followed or even respected by the world community. If the US were more sensitive to world's opinions on issues that affect ALL of us instead of behaving like a "spoiled rotten child" (see land mines agreement, Kyoto protocol, protectionist practices in industries such as steel, orange, agriculture, etc, etc...) people would have less reason to cherish an anti-americanism sentiment. The large perception out there is that the US does not practice what it preaches, and this IS something you folks should give a darn about! Please, tell me if I'm wrong in my analysis. >My objection is not to what foreigners in general think -- they are >entitled to their opinions. It is to people who supposedly want >metrication, but run around mischaracterizing most Americans. I've said on >this forum before: you can't slam people as misinformed or stupid or >arrogant or anything like that, and then turn around and expect them to >give the slightest damn about what you think or say. > And here we've always agreed, Jim. Less confrontation and more cooperation indeed should bring more fruitful results. ... As to "there is only hot or cold ... you are either >pro-metric or against metric ..." all I can say is "hogwash." John is >trying to create a dichotomy that does not exist, so that he can continue >his incessant slandering of Americans. > I think that what John meant was that if you do not take a stand in favor of metrication you're actually being against it because the status quo continues!!! Who or how can anyone argue otherwise? ... >Since I started metricating my company, 112 people have worked here. These >range from uneducated laborers to highly-educated engineers. Very few are >anti-metrication (only one that comes to mind, and he, sadly, is an >electrical engineer). Very few are really pro-metrication (none come to >mind). Most are either (a) scared that they cannot learn it, or (b) wonder >if there is any real reason to learn it. Both groups are easy to move onto >the metric bandwagon, not as real cheerleaders, but as educated users who >most assuredly are **not** anti-metrication. > I'm really glad that you shared this small sample statistics with us, Jim. The above raises some very worrisome questions that I feel we MUST address. If despite your company being fully metric you don't see more individuals coming forth in defense of the SI system, then I'm afraid something must be majorly wrong somewhere. And on this, please forgive me for saying, it seems very difficult to justify it in any other way than that there may be some innate or natural averseness against the SI system among your citizenry! I honestly cannot believe that people can really NOT speak in favor of the SI system once they learn and use it unless they're naturally biased! What I mean is, if they're exposed *professionally* to the system, i.e. they must use it at their place of work, how can they NOT see the benefits of its use??? You said that they are: either scared of it or wonder if there is real benefit (reason) for learning it. Darn it! I'm sorry, but one would have to be really blind for not seeing the light! Honestly, scared of WHAT??? If they attended some training on the subject and allegedly understand what the SI system is all about and are now using it, how can they be 'scared' of it??? The second justification is actually a corolary of the first and even more strikingly surprising to me. How can ANYONE (for that matter) not see a reason for learning it specially considering the undeniable fact that it is used everywhere else in the world??? Gee, am I missing something here, Jim? Please, help me understand this. In any case. Perhaps you could help fix this by being more "proactive" in your training and use sections. People in the US MUST be made to REALLY **understand and experience** in practical terms the benefits of the SI system, otherwise, why bother? The fundamental thing here is that we're just not defending an alternative system, Jim, but rather a **correct** way of going about the issue of metrology, period! That's what we inculcate and indoctrinate people about in metric countries, and why global metric users when faced with exposure to ifp they all invariably comment: "ah, this is archaic, obsolete, mediocre stuff" (which is INDEED what it is about!!!). ... >Note the "We": in this respect he is making the same error of which I am >accusing John: stereotyping a country of 275 million people. Some people in >this country are very pro-metric. Others are very anti-metric. The vast >majority are neutral: they do not have much contact with the issue of >metrication, and don't really care one way or the other. > Perhaps the above assessment is true. However, 'not caring' in practical terms really mean being against it after all, 'cause the status quo carries the day, Jim! I sincerely hope you can at least see that, my dear friend. >But, the proper response by us is NOT more over-generalization and name >calling. That will only turn people off to our message. > No argument here! :-) ... >I obviously cannot change your mind here (at least not yet!), although at >the consumer level I think there has been substantial progress in the last >seven years. I **know** there has been substantial progress in electronic >manufacturing, which I deal with every day. > Two things. Until I can really see and feel that the environment around me IS indeed changing how can I ever contemplate a change of mind? Perhaps living in a nearly all-out ifp environment like in the US one could probably perceive some changes in attitudes more clearly. But here in Canada, a country that portrays itself as being metric continuing to use ifp nearly exclusively around us in many areas is unfortunately at least a demonstration that ifp is actually making significant inroads back to the stage! Secondly, I'd be really curious to learn about such 'progress' you talk about in the electronic industry. Why? Well, most units of measurements in electrical/electronic industries *already* are in metric! What else, besides dimensions of chips and whatnot what there be to metricate? Besides, I've heard somewhere that actually the industry has apparently gone back to the stupid 0.1" cell crap when dimensioning boards! >And I have not forgotten our bet. I expect to collect in about nine years. > Jim, nothing (again I repeat) would give me more pleasure than to lose our bet, trust me! :-) Marcus Is your boss reading your email? ....Probably Keep your messages private by using Lycos Mail. Sign up today at http://mail.lycos.com
