Thanks for this kPa. And thanks for the compliments. Regarding sending my
previous response only to you, that was in my haste as we were preparing to go
out. This email has gone to the entire listserver, so everyone can now catch
up with the entire thread.
I like your idea of a book for the consumer put out by the supermarkets. It's
something that is certainly needed, and while there will of course be the usual
howls of protest/derision from the BWMA, I would imagine that the average
consumer might just like it. My other half, even though she's a (now retired)
scientist in neurology (and therefore quite used to using SI in the laboratory)
still herself occasionally gets a bit confused in the shops (bear in mind that
she, like me, was educated in a pre-metric school world), so I think there is a
call for something on the lines you have suggested. I will certainly give it
much thought - as you say, it has to be VERY consumer-friendly, but that is
something that appeals to me very much,
Cheers
John F-L
----- Original Message -----
From: Kilopascal
To: John Frewen-Lord ; U.S. Metric Association
Sent: Sunday, June 12, 2011 12:50 PM
Subject: Re: [USMA:50549] Re: Fwd: ASDA pound campaign
Since you wrote a book, you may be able to work with your publisher to
publish a booklet on smart metric shopping and how to break free of the
imperial crutch. Your publisher may even know ways to get financial support to
pay for the booklet so it can be given away for free. Something that would
benefit those who insist that metric shopping is a burden and they have to
spend extra time to figure it out. Of course there are those who are so biased
against metric that no amount of training would help, so then let them suffer.
Instead of businesses like ASDA reverting to imperial sizes they would be
better off in the long run in offering seminars and classes on smart metric
shopping. Someone with your knowledge and expertise could play a vital role in
organizing it. This whole fiasco, if played right could be the catalyst needed
to finally finish the metrication in this industry and end dual pricing as well
as non-metric (not rounded) sizes of some remaining products. Why not work
with ASDA, Tesco, Sainsbury and others to include a smart metric shopping guide
to their website as a help in adjusting to metric shopping?
I don't find a problem with 400 g because it is a rounded number, but I would
find a problem with 396 g as that is a hidden 14 ounces. I understand that a
business needs to downsize its products when it experiences huge price
increases and can't just raise the price without causing discomfort for the
consuming public. But they should downsize to a rounded metric amount. 400 g
or 450 g would be preferable to 396 g or 454 g and 200 g instead of 227 g.
This is where the problem with their actions lie, in going from a rounded
amount to a non-rounded amount instead of a rounded amount to a rounded amount.
I'm surprised you didn't respond to this email via the USMA list server. You
spent a lot of time writing a lot of good stuff that would benefit other
readers but instead only I saw it.
From: John Frewen-Lord
Sent: Sunday, 2011-06-12 06:47
To: Kilopascal
Subject: Re: [USMA:50549] Re: Fwd: ASDA pound campaign
Hi kPa:
I agree - the only fuss is being made by the likes of the BWMA and its
supporters, who as far as I can see make far more noise than their ground-swell
support would merit. Many people are actually objecting to ASDA's approach -
many comments are saying that recipe books have been metric now for 30 years,
and use rounded metric quantities (e.g. 500 g of raw beef, etc). For ASDA to
then sell raw beef in 454 g packs just makes the whole process too hard.
I agree that the strawberries are shown in metric only (which was the point
of my post in Metric Views), and I feel that ASDA are committed to the 227 g
size for a while, as they no doubt have bought about 5 billion of them and have
to use them all up. Then they will go back to the 250 g size, increasing the
price as they do so - or even (in a bit of smart publicity) saying 250 g for
the price of 227 g!
Almost all products are in rounded metric sizes on the shelves. Whether it's
cornflakes, butter, cheese (except for individually wrapped cheeses which are
in individual sizes, still labelled in grams of course), coffee, canned stuff,
shampoo, soap, washing products, etc etc, all in rational (for the most part)
metric sizes. Some may be a bit odd - why canned tomatoes are in 400 g cans is
anyone's guess.
The point is that very, very little is not metric. The loose veggies etc MAY
(but by no means always) be shown dual marked (which annoys me, as I then have
to figure out which price to look at and make my assessment as to whether it's
good value or not). I have developed some rough pricing criteria, and it's
amazing how such a diversity of foods end up being similarly priced on a unit
price basis. My criteria are £2 to £4/kg - good value; £4 to £7/kg - typical
for a lot of stuff; £7 to £12/kg - more expensive meats and fish; anything over
£12/kg - usually too expensive for us! So if I see some fish (or cheese) at
around £6/kg, I know that's very good value. And seeing prices for items
measured in pounds (or ounces) just throws that pricing assessment system off
base.
Anyway, gotta go - we have a country-wide farm open day today, so we will be
visting a local farm. Most farmers work in metric, but I will look out for any
non-metric bits!
Cheers
John F-L
----- Original Message -----
From: Kilopascal
To: j...@frewston.plus.com ; U.S. Metric Association
Sent: Sunday, June 12, 2011 4:33 AM
Subject: [USMA:50549] Re: Fwd: ASDA pound campaign
John,
If you peruse the ASDA website, you would wonder what all the excitement
was about concerning these strawberries. Every thing I saw there was only
stated in metric sizes, except for their brand labeled milk:
http://groceries.asda.com/asda-estore/catalog/sectionpagecontainer.jsp?departmentid=1214921923758
All of the unit pricing is metric, even the milk pints.
Even the strawberries are shown in metric only:
http://groceries.asda.com/asda-estore/catalog/sectionpagecontainer.jsp?departmentid=1214921923758
Anyone not aware that 227 g is half a pound would not be satisfied that the
store reverted to imperial. If I hated the metric system I would not be
satisfied until the metric was dropped from the website and only imperial was
shown. That definitely is not going to happen.
As far as I can see the vast majority of products shown are in rounded
metric sizes. If British shoppers are truly confused by metric, then how is it
that downsizing a 250 g pack of something to 227 g is going to cure them of
their confusion when there are tens of thousands of rounded metric products
that will never change?
I can't speak for the UK, but here in the US we have been experiencing a
steady and steep rise in food prices. I can see where a company like ASDA
would try to control rising prices in fresh fruits and vegetables by
down-sizing. But it is sinister to hide this behind the wishes of the ignorant
to return to imperial by pretending they were granting their wish but in
reality they were trying to prevent a loss of sales if the prices did go up
instead. So they distracted the consumer with happy talk of returning to
imperial. And to add insult to injury they got the BWMA and the anti-metric
media to support it.
Hopefully the UKMA can take advantage of this and discredit both ASDA and
the BWMA for their deceptive actions. I wonder if any consumer protection
groups in the UK would be interested bringing this issue to the public and
expose ASDAs and the BWMAs motives.
[USMA:50549] Re: Fwd: ASDA pound campaign
John Frewen-Lord
Thu, 02 Jun 2011 13:35:30 -0700
Thanks for this Pat. This is actually my neck of the woods (N E Lincolnshire)
- I never realised we were so retarded! I have added my own comment, which
should show up by now.
Cheers
John F-LDear All,
Another report of the same obfuscation, deceit, and plain straight out
cheating from ASDA:
http://www.thisislincolnshire.co.uk/Supermarket-sells-strawberries-pound/story-12656150-detail/story.html
Cheers,
Pat Naughtin
Geelong, Australia
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