Hello Ivan and Everyone, This topic has gone far beyond the scope of this forum.
Consequently, this thread is to be terminated, immediately. Do not reply to this post or this thread as doing so will result in the immediate suspension of your posting privileges. Thank you all. Moderator Mark From: viphone@googlegroups.com <viphone@googlegroups.com> On Behalf Of Ivan Icin Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2023 12:29 PM To: VIPhone <viphone@googlegroups.com> Subject: Re: changes with voicedream apps Mary, I appreciate that you looked on my app on Android. If you read my posts I expect that at least 90% of current Voice Dream Reader won’t switch. However I also expect that 99% of new users will use Speech Central. Let’s be honest, if you have never ever used any app and your mind wasn’t accommodated to Voice Dream specific design for years, would you pay 80$/year for it or would you pick Speech Central for free? I don’t see what is your problem that I try to reach to people that need this information in render to help them. As said again I don’t have any problem with anyone using Voice Dream. But I do have the problem on people commenting that it is worth 80$/year while my app is not worth of a single download even that it has many features that Voice Dream doesn’t have and can be left on device as the second app if nothing else. Regarding the work on the app, I do plan to release by the end of the year new version that will have more new features than cumulative Voice Dream updates in the last five years. Hopefully that’s enough? On Wednesday, July 12, 2023 at 9:08:05 PM UTC+2 Mary Otten wrote: I wish you would put as much effort into that app that you’re so proud of as this thread. Give it up. Make your own app so great that people will just love it. I don’t. I tried it on android and couldn’t make heads or tails of it. Different OS of course. But I’m happy with Voice Dream right now, so why should I try a different app if Voice Dream does what I want? I’ve used it for years and continue to do so. Make your abs so good that you make me want to change. Sent from my iPhone On Jul 12, 2023, at 11:27 AM, Ivan Icin <mailto:labsii...@gmail.com> wrote: Sieghard, Just in this thread Richard has quoted the "sustainability" and "maintenance" as important reason why some app needs the 60$/year subscription (which is now higher but he found that initial value as acceptable). He clearly was very supportive regarding this. Independent of Voice Dream, I think it is important question to educate the community regarding this, if you agree? Just to say that I don't think that people will use my app because they like me or don't like me. Most of the people used Voice Dream because someone recommended that to them and because it is a really well made app. On Wednesday, July 12, 2023 at 7:49:24 PM UTC+2 Sieghard Weitzel wrote: Ivan, I think this topic is pretty much exhausted by now. Richard is clearly not Winston and Winston has sold his app so why continue to badger him to respond to these snippets of whatever emails have been sent. I got Voice Dream Reader a long time ago and I can't remember if it was free at the time or if I paid something for it, but I don't hardly use it and when I do then it's maybe to listen to an audio book in MNP3 format. I don't listen to books which are in text format because I simply don'tenjoy it compared to listening to a real human reader, but I do keep it on my iPhone and I noticed many updates since the new company bought it. Granted, they just say "bug fixes and performance improvements" and no specifics are given, but specifics or not I assume any small fixes they implement are hopefully a good thing and at least you can see that they seem to be commited to the product. It is my understanding that anybody who owned the product before does not have to pay the subscription price, if it came to a point where I had to pay it then I would probably not do so because as I said, I use a very small part of what the app is capable of and I am sure I can find a free alternative for that. One last comment, for me if I see and read a lot of the type of posts you have posted which are very confrontational and defensive, it does not want to make me use your app should I ever be in a position where I may want to use it. I am not saying I absolutely wouldn't use it, but the more you post and continue stirring the pot about this the less I would be likely to try your app. It's childish and immature and you have to learn to get over it; focus on your app and what it does well, make it better and point out these things. I truly wish you wel lwith your app and that it is successful and that it will help people for years to come, but just let it go and stop this pissing contest which isn't useful to anybody. Best regards, Sieghard From: mailto:vip...@googlegroups.com <mailto:vip...@googlegroups.com> On Behalf Of Ivan Icin Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2023 10:25 AM To: VIPhone <mailto:vip...@googlegroups.com> Subject: Re: changes with voicedream apps One question for Richard, how he would describe this. Winston said at the launch of the Mac app that he had spent most of the time in last two years in building this app. Right after that he said that maintenance of the app takes too much time and he has hard time to keep up with that and that’s why all changes are needed. Do I miss something or he clearly said that for two years he put very little effort in updating the iOS app and everything worked properly? There is still a blog post on that so everything can be checked. On Monday, July 10, 2023 at 11:17:57 PM UTC+2 Ivan Icin wrote: To be precise the problem is in that narrative that one man business is inherently unsustainable. It is like claiming that bigger boat is more sustainable. Out of context that may sound true, but in shallow waters small boat is better. If the market is really big then you could say that big corp is better than one man show. But if it isn’t the big corp won’t be able to handle its weight. The corporation needs not just wages but also much more expensive infrastructure and profits. P On Monday, July 10, 2023 at 9:24:32 PM UTC+2 Ivan Icin wrote: Richard, I am not calling him a lier, I haven't said more than what I have said and that is your word, but let's say that it is a spin if you insist on qualifying that, or maybe even better a questionable conclusion process that may not come from the intention to "lie". You probably know that Voice Dream Reader was available for Android. It is sold to a company called Legere something like two years ago and I guess that their revenue is less than 5000$ (SensorTower doesn't show values below that), at some points I got some analytics report that it is around 1000$ a month. It is updated to support new versions of Android thus far and still costs 9.99$. No matter how hard I try I see Legere more sustainable than Applause Group. Applause Group may decide not to handle Voice Dream Reader at 40,000$/month and thus far they have hard time to go above that. Corporation can hardly have even one full time dedicated employee at that budget. On Monday, July 10, 2023 at 9:06:50 PM UTC+2 Richard Turner wrote: Ivan, you are calling Winston a lier, which I would never do. If the sustainablility is a fake narrative, that comes directly from Winston. Richard, USA. “What we think or what we know or what we believe is in the end of little consequence. The only thing of consequence is what we do” ~ John Ruskin My web site: https://www.turner42.com On Jul 10, 2023, at 11:20 AM, Ivan Icin <mailto:labsii...@gmail.com> wrote: Thus far you have two benefits that I know: • Acapela voices are now part of the subscription • You also get the Mac license Regarding the sustainability, that is a fake narrative. Winston was giving interviews that his family is living well from Voice Dream, and assuming that SensorTower doesn't lie, total sales were 40,000$/month. Just to be clear it isn't too much for the American developer (but certainly not too little either). But it is also true that the app can be sustainable in India for even less than 5000$ a month, so even the app that costs 5$/lifetime could be sustainable in some circumstances. But for American products the most of the money goes into the marketing. If you start to buy App Store ads, you need to pay 2$ per click on the ad for the US consumer. And Winston did that and as such he paid at least 10$ to get the users (assuming that he was a champion in conversion so it could be more).If you go into such costs then your business can quickly become unsustainable. Just to note that at the start those ads were priced reasonably so many people jumped in, but as prices went up Apple started to squeeze out nearly all their money and devs kept pushing the price increase to end consumers. At the moment I don't have access to those analytics products so I can't say if Voice Dream is buying the ads now (unfortunately I price my app very low to help people so I need to be careful about all expenses). But with 80$/year subscription your conversion rates start to fall off significantly, so at that price point it is likely that you need to pay at least 50$ to get a paid customer through App Store ads. If that is their business model (and for almost all subscription apps it is), those prices seem more reasonable. I made suggestions that people make a pressure on Apple to disable App Store ads on disability search terms, but thus far no one supported me. I don't think that Apple will do that by themselves as they clearly earn a lot, but then if anyone showed how much they are pumping up prices for the products that people need to support their lives, that would be a bigger cost to their PR than the money they make from it. On Monday, July 10, 2023 at 4:33:30 PM UTC+2 Sieghard Weitzel wrote: You don't have to pay it if you feel you don't get value for it. -----Original Message----- From: mailto:vip...@googlegroups.com <mailto:vip...@googlegroups.com> On Behalf Of Kelby Carlson Sent: Monday, July 10, 2023 7:12 AM To: mailto:vip...@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: changes with voicedream apps And exactly what improvements to the app have they made since they acquired it? The only thing I can verify is an extremely minor bug fix. A price point of $100/year is insane. On 7/9/23, Ivan Icin <mailto:labsii...@gmail.com> wrote: > Let’s bring some facts together: > > The iOS app is subscription based since April 23th, so it is almost > three months now. > > It has started with 60$/year price. > > In the meantime they have tried many price points from 40$/year to > 100$/year, even selling at multiple different prices at the same time. > > At the moment they seem to have settled to the 80$/year price, though > at least to some extent 100$/year price was still active fairly recently. > Other price points were not active for quite a time. > > Those are facts. > On Sunday, July 9, 2023 at 4:29:25 PM UTC+2 Richard Turner wrote: > >> IN a few weeks, we should find out what the actual price will be. >> >> I guess we should give them time to sort out their pricing structure. >> I'm >> >> hopeful it will end up being lower than it is showing right now. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Richard, USA. >> >> “Reality is the leading cause of stress for those who are in touch >> with it.” -- Jane Wagner from The Search for Intelligent Life in >> the Universe >> >> >> >> My web site: https://www.turner42.com >> >> >> >> *From:* mailto:vip...@googlegroups.com <mailto:vip...@googlegroups.com> *On >> Behalf >> Of *Sieghard Weitzel >> *Sent:* Saturday, July 8, 2023 9:48 AM >> *To:* mailto:vip...@googlegroups.com >> *Subject:* RE: changes with voicedream apps >> >> >> >> When I looked it up last night it was $79.99 not $59.99 and here in >> Canada >> >> it is $99.99 a year. >> >> >> >> >> >> *From:* mailto:vip...@googlegroups.com <mailto:vip...@googlegroups.com> *On >> Behalf >> Of *Mo Khan >> *Sent:* Saturday, July 8, 2023 3:27 AM >> *To:* mailto:vip...@googlegroups.com >> *Subject:* changes with voicedream apps >> >> >> >> Changes with Voice Dream apps >> >> Have you heard the news? Learn about the changes and new names for >> our beloved Voice Dream apps! >> >> Voice Dream Reader logo >> >> <img class="resource-featured-image-hero" src=" >> https://www.perkins.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/06/voice_dream_icon.jpeg"; >> >> alt="Voice Dream Reader logo"> >> >> Have you heard the news? The beloved Voice Dream apps are changing! >> The original developer, Winston Chen has turned Voice Dream Reader >> over to the >> >> Applause Group, a company able to sustain Voice Dream Reader. The >> name has >> >> been changed to Text to Speech TTS Voice Dream. TTS Voice Dream >> enables you to listen to PDFs, Web pages, and books using >> text-to-speech. >> >> Note: On April 25, 2023, Voice Dream Reader became a >> subscription-based app for $59.99 per year. A free trial was available. >> >> Voice Dream Scanner and Voice Dream Writer remain with Winston; >> although, >> >> he has formed a new company, Opus Noma and the app names have been >> changed >> >> to VDScan and VDWrite. VDScan is an OCR app used to scan inaccessible >> PDF >> >> or text image and converts the text to an accessible document that >> can be >> >> read by a screen reader. VDWrite is a text-to-speech writing app that >> reduces mistakes, helps you use the right words, and helps organize >> and improve the structure of your writing. >> >> Winston’s press release >> >> Dear Customers, Partners, and Friends, >> >> I am delighted to announce that Voice Dream Reader has joined >> Applause Group as a leading product in their portfolio of apps. >> >> Voice Dream Reader started 12 years ago as a side project during my >> sabbatical in Arctic Norway. Since then, it has evolved into the best >> text-to-speech reader, helping hundreds of thousands of people >> worldwide read for learning and fun. Winning Apple Design Award in >> 2021 was the crowning achievement of my professional life. >> >> But I could not have done it without the users. You constantly >> provided me >> >> with ideas for improvements and inspired me with your personal >> stories of >> >> how Reader changed your lives. And I could not have done it without >> my partners and friends who supported me at every step. For that, I >> will be forever grateful. >> >> While I look at the past with nostalgia, I also look to the future >> with excitement. Applause Group is committed to investing in Reader >> and turning >> >> it into a household name. It will be stewarded by a sustainable >> company instead of being completely dependent on me. And that is good >> news for everyone who relies on Reader every day. >> >> With Reader going to a new home, Voice Dream Scanner and Writer will >> remain with me under a different company, Opus Noma. (Noma stands for >> my children Nora and Marcus.) And they will be renamed to VDScan and >> VDWrite. >> >> My new email address is mailto:winsto...@opusnoma.com. >> >> Happy reading, as we all look forward to a bright future. >> >> Winston >> >> -- >> The following information is important for all members of the V >> iPhone list. >> >> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, >> or if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact >> the owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. >> >> Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor. Mark can be reached at: >> mailto:mk...@ucla.edu. 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