Steven Vincent Johnson wrote:
Hi Stephen,
Non-interference? I beg to differ. You might want to take that
up with a few
Tibetans.
Tibet is part of China, of course, and what China does with Tibet is all
"internal affairs" of China. :-/
Again, you might want to take that up with a few Tibetians. :-\
I'm well aware of your point! What's more, I'm not disagreeing. IMHO
the railroad China's running into Tibet is another aspect to their
invasion of that country, _not_ an example of how they are better
uniting the kingdom of Cathay. Perhaps I should have put quotes around
"part of China"...?
I was just trying to say that the Chinese government is very fond of
invoking the doctrine of "no interference in internal affairs" in a wide
range of cases, including those where any reasonably disinterested party
would say the affair in question is most certainly EXternal.
I don't believe the Taiwanese are any happier about China's
"meddling" either.
Taiwan is absolutely considered part of China by the mainland Chinese
government, and United States arms going to Taiwan is the "meddling"
which is taking place.
And again, you might want to take that up with a few Taiwanese. HINT: Your
opinion would NOT be considered a popular one. ;-)
Right, for sure. Claims that there's "just one China" are nonsense IMHO
(a claim which both Nationalist China and People's Republic of China
governments have made at various times).
But again, the doctrine of non-interference in internal affairs
certainly has been invoked by the mainland Chinese government as
justification for shouting at the United States for aiding Taiwan.
So, maybe, like the British in previous generations, they've also been
guilty of believing some of their own propaganda. Anyhow that was the
original point, such as it was.
To clarify my previous somewhat muddled statement, the Nationalist Party
headed by Chiang Kai-shek essentially took over the Taiwanese government
when they fled the mainland back in the 40s. The takeover of the Taiwanese
government by the ousted Nationalist party, by some accounts, was just as
brutal as the draconian consolidation that was simultaneously going on in
the mainland headed by Mao.
But claims that it was a dictatorship were nonsense, of course. ;-)
It was a properly constituted democracy. The only hitch was that
elections on the island of Taiwan were, of course, impossible to hold
until the parliamentarians could campaign properly and stand for
election in their home districts, which were, of course, mostly on the
mainland. So elections simply had to be suspended for the duration of
the emergency, until such time as the government could return to its
seat on the mainland and they could once again be held sensibly. But the
suspension of elections was purely temporary, of course.
I have heard it said that Chiang Kai-shek actually used that argument to
justify remaining in power for 40 years without an election (or however
long it was). I don't know if he really did; haven't checked it.
The United States ended up supporting the
Nationalist party on Taiwan because it served our own political and
strategic interests to do so. We were most certainly "meddling" in Taiwan's
internal affairs in that sense. But such are the stuff of political dramas
and strange bed fellows. I would say that everyone who felt they had an
invested interest in Taiwan was caught "meddling" in the island's internal
affairs. We are not the only guilty party. Not by a long shot.
Historically the United States looks pretty heroic in its behavior
toward China, if you contrast it with the European nations, IMHO, and
about this I'm quite serious. Perhaps Roosevelt got us into the war
just to save us from Japan -- but I'd like to think he did it at least
in part to save China, as well, about which nobody else seemed to much
care at the time. (Of course I'm thinking of the pressure he put on
Japan in advance of Pearl Harbor which most likely precipitated the
conflict.)
Of course the European treatment of China was sufficiently awful that
almost anything would look good by contrast -- treaty ports, opium wars,
oh my....
I would recommend you talk to a real indigenous Taiwanese who was born and
raised in Taiwan.
Why? I've already spent some time speaking with a mainlander, and I
doubt anyone from Taiwan could have a more negative view of the mainland
Chinese government than she had. I remember I started to say something
fatuous about how communist leaders are idealists (using a narrow
definition of "idealist") and I never got to the end of the sentence;
got interrupted with a tirade against the evil old men who were just
holding onto power against all comers, who had no ideals, sense of duty,
morals, or notions of right or wrong whatsoever. This was a few years
ago before they started loosening up a bit over there but it's probably
still a pretty accurate portrayal of what goes on at the top in China.
It should not be misconstrued that the indigenous
Tiawanese population consider themselves a part of the Mainland.
No, of course not -- it's the /government/ to which I intended to refer
in all cases, which is not synonymous with the common folk, in any
country I'm aware of.
I suspect
the brutal takeover by the Nationalist party only confirmed their opinion of
"Great Dragon's" incessant meddling.
Yup, and I doubt the Ainu think too highly of the Japanese government,
either, for that matter...
FWIW: My family lived in Taiwan back in the early 60 for approximately three
years. My father was a production manager for Foremost Dairies, a San
Francisco based company that supplied dairy products across the globe.
Foremost had many plants across the Pacific as well. We supplied dairy
products to Americans and their families living in Taiwan. This included a
very large contingency of U.S. military based on the island, and a few CIA
operatives and their families working there as well.
Regards,
Steven Vincent Johnson
www.OrionWorks.com
www.Zazzle.com/orionworks
