"One thing I don't get is why solar costs so much more than nuclear or coal fired. There's almost no moving parts, and much less to break down, it seems to me. There's got to be some politics in this somewhere, but I don't know exactly where."
A broad subject... One factor is that the amount of power can only be the maximum number of watts/sq metre... multiplied of course by the overall system efficiency. All seriously limiting of course. Add computerized tracking and we have a huge capital cost increase. Another factor is the fact that these collectors (photovoltaic or thermal) tend to become wonderful sails under windy conditions, so they have to be installed ruggedly. On roofs, that costs lots. In addition, installing them on roofs means that the roofing membranes have to be made watertight... You get the drift. The overall question is: How many watts can be obtained from a huge system and at what capital cost. Used to be a no-brainer. Wasn't financially justifiable. Now, I dunno. My (somewhat educated) opinion on the uses of solar, was that small independent systems in very hot, sunny climates could be justified based on the alternative: expensive power from the grid. A decent application was the installation of smallish systems that would drive the ceiling fans in apartment blocks in India. Power up around 10:00 am and power down around 2:00 or 3:00 pm - the hottest period of the day. A system, some wires, some inexpensive DC fans. Then there was a proposal we undertook to pump water using small solar pumping stations, for irrigation in the Sahel region of Africa. Couldn't get the political guys to see the sense in that to the point of funding it. Better to sell (or give) guns and bombs to the Africans. P. ----- Original Message ---- From: Kyle Mcallister <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2008 7:53:36 PM Subject: Re: [Vo]:Earth Hour...yeah.... --- OrionWorks <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I'm impressed! > > Knock yourself out tonight! > Heh, thanks Steven. I /probably/ was being mostly sarcastic in my "evil plan" statement of action, as I'll probably be making Hartley oscillators all night, as well as chasing down the rumors I hear from a friend that there are a few nice, old 1940's style 365pF air-variable capacitors just hanging around an old dump, gathering dust. Unclaimed, I might add. If weather permits, we're gonna go fetch 'em. Thing is, I am, despite appearances, very concerned about the environment, particularly destruction of rain forests. That's something that bothers me badly. But I can't stand the way the issue has been so politicized. People are making money off this, when they should be spending money to fix it. But I try to conserve as much as I possibly can, whilst not destroying my quality of life. It's been saving me a hell of a lot of money, too, but that's not why I do it. If I absolutely KNEW for a dead certain fact that it would be used to build EFFECTIVE solar collectors, or wind farms, or what have you, I'd bite the bullet and pay an extra $1 per gallon, starting right now. But I have no proof this will happen. I live in New York, the land of taxes that pay for the lazy to do no work, or for hookers for the Governor, and so on. I trust no taxes here. I'm opposed to more taxes on gasoline, because I know it will not be used to solve the problem. One thing I don't get is why solar costs so much more than nuclear or coal fired. There's almost no moving parts, and much less to break down, it seems to me. There's got to be some politics in this somewhere, but I don't know exactly where. As much as we disagree on things, I'm wondering if Jed can shed some light on this. Where _really_ is the cost discrepancy coming from? If we build the damned things in the desert, where there's plenty of Sun, what's the deal? If it is efficiency, hell, you just build more for less cost per unit. Big deal. The fuel is free...what gives? I'm a heck of a fan of solar heat for houses...but it seems like no one likes that idea any more. Pity, it can work wonders. Even up here, people have made thermal cisterns to store up heat over the summer, and they heat their homes in the winter with the hot water. In the end, it seems to boil down to one thing: the more you tax, the more it's wasted on 'special interest groups,' which nowadays can mean ANYTHING. As for me, once was a Republican. Not any more. Just an American, blue-collar man, who tries to be the best he can for his wife, and tries to help those he can. That's about all I am. Sworn to no political party. I'm also told I'm pretty weird. Might be true. --Kyle, who in the past couple of days, has come to the conclusion that nothing oscillates when you want it to, but always will when you DON'T want it to. ____________________________________________________________________________________ Special deal for Yahoo! users & friends - No Cost. Get a month of Blockbuster Total Access now http://tc.deals.yahoo.com/tc/blockbuster/text3.com