Anthony, it is not off topic at all, and some of the related Annual Plan effects are very troubling in their present manifestation.
Please see: https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Topic:Ubi1v8gwsq09bzjp On Wed, Apr 18, 2018 at 6:23 AM, Anthony Cole <ahcole...@gmail.com> wrote: > This is off-topic (I presume) but the idea of the WMF increasing its > dependence on large corporate donors is beginning to trouble me. I want the > WMF to answer to our readers and volunteers not Bezos, Brin and Zuckerberg. > > I say I presume this is off-topic because I presume the WMF isn’t, even > subconsciously, soft-peddling our share-alike right and right to effective > attribution from these re-users in exchange for dollars from these re-users. > > On Wed, 18 Apr 2018 at 5:58 pm, James Heilman <jmh...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Agree with Gerard. We WANT Youtube, Facebook, and others to use our >> content. That is one reason why we have released it under an open license >> and I believe one reason why we have been so successful. We of course also >> want them to provide appropriate attribution. I think this would be better >> achieved by reaching out and discussing it with these groups directly >> rather than initially by legal means. In my experience most reputable >> organizations are happy to attribute when asked. >> >> With respect to intermediation and them providing financial or direct >> technical support Google, Apple, and Microsoft are listed here as major >> beneficiaries as is the Brin Wojcicki Foundation >> https://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Benefactors Would the WMF be happy >> with greater support? Yes I imagine so. >> >> James >> >> Please note that this is written in a personal capacity and does not >> represent an official position of anyone but myself. >> >> On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 7:41 AM, Gerard Meijssen < >> gerard.meijs...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >> > Hoi, >> > Maybe you know, but Katherine Mayer gave a talk at the CC conference The >> > subject was big companies using our content (it is not just writing) and >> > making a profit giving nothing / not much in return. The issue she raised >> > is that it may interfere with our collaboration model. People will >> > associate our content with the company that profits in this way and not >> > contribute their knowledge their expertise with us. >> > >> > So no word from the WMF, far from it. When you want the WMF to sue.. >> There >> > is wonder if the effect it will have is really what we want. For me it is >> > first and foremost that people are properly informed and I prefer a >> YouTube >> > a Facebook to use our data over them not to do so over license issues. >> > Remember the days when Wikipedia was young; it was a wide held belief. >> > Thanks, >> > GerardM >> > >> > On 16 April 2018 at 01:53, Anthony Cole <ahcole...@gmail.com> wrote: >> > >> > > Is someone from WMF monitoring wikimedia-l and notifying relevant >> > employees >> > > when an issue arises under their remit? This issue - big companies >> using >> > > our writing without attribution and like-licensing - has been hanging >> > with >> > > no word from the WMF for six months. >> > > >> > > Anthony Cole >> > > >> > > >> > > On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 6:22 PM, Anthony Cole <ahcole...@gmail.com> >> > wrote: >> > > >> > > > I see this from Brian Heater at Tech Crunch on 25 March: >> > > > >> > > > "In a conversation earlier this week, Wikimedia’s Chief Revenue >> Office, >> > > > Lisa Gruwell told TechCrunch that this sort of usage doesn’t >> constitute >> > > any >> > > > sort of formal relationship. Most companies more or less hook into an >> > API >> > > > to utilize that breadth of knowledge. It’s handy for sure, and *it’s >> > all >> > > > well within Wikimedia’s fair use rules*, but as with Maher’s letter, >> > the >> > > > CRO expressed some concerns about seemingly one-sided relationships >> ... >> > > *Smart >> > > > assistants are certainly playing by the applicable rules when it >> comes >> > to >> > > > leveraging that information base.*"[1] >> > > > >> > > > That article I link to has both Katherine (WMF ED) and Lisa (Chief >> > > Revenue >> > > > Officer) asking the companies who use our work for free to "give >> > back." I >> > > > want them to give back too, but I don't absolve them of their >> > obligation >> > > to >> > > > meaningfully attribute my work and share it with the same rights >> > > attached. >> > > > If it is the opinion of the WMF that these smart assistants are not >> > > > breaching my rights, I'd like to see the legal advice that opinion is >> > > based >> > > > on. >> > > > >> > > > 1.https://techcrunch.com/2018/03/24/are-corporations-that- >> > > > use-wikipedia-giving-back/ >> > > > >> > > > Anthony Cole >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 5:47 PM, WereSpielChequers < >> > > > werespielchequ...@gmail.com> wrote: >> > > > >> > > >> Yes of course the WMF can contact those who are detected reusing our >> > > >> content without fully complying with licenses and encourage them to >> > > >> comply. >> > > >> >> > > >> If a case were to go to court it would need to have one or more >> > > >> contributors who were willing to cooperate with WMF legal in the >> case. >> > > But >> > > >> I doubt there would be a shortage of contributors who were keen to >> do >> > > so. >> > > >> >> > > >> As for why the WMF should do so, here are three reasons: >> > > >> >> > > >> Each of our wikis is a crowd sourced project. Crowd sourcing >> requires >> > a >> > > >> crowd, if a crowd settles down and stabilises it becomes a >> community. >> > > The >> > > >> community is broadly stable, but we need a steady flow of new >> > > wikimedians, >> > > >> and our only really effective way of recruiting new Wikimedians is >> for >> > > >> them >> > > >> to see the edit button on our sites. An increasing shift to our >> > content >> > > >> being used without attribution is an existential threat to the >> project >> > > and >> > > >> hence to the WMF. >> > > >> >> > > >> Our communities are made up of volunteers with diverse motivations. >> > For >> > > >> some of us the BY-SA part of the licensing is important, personally >> I >> > > feel >> > > >> good when i see one of my photos used by someone else but attributed >> > to >> > > >> me. >> > > >> If the de facto policy of the WMF was to treat volunteer >> contributions >> > > as >> > > >> effectively CC0 this would be demotivating for some members of our >> > > >> community. I'm also active on another site where every member >> > regularly >> > > >> gets stats on their readership, something I very much doubt would >> > happen >> > > >> if >> > > >> it wasn't an effective mechanism to encourage continued >> participation. >> > > >> >> > > >> Every organisation needs money, the WMF gets most of its money by >> > asking >> > > >> for it on wikipedia and other sites. Again, encouraging attribution >> > back >> > > >> to >> > > >> Wikipedia etc tackles the existential threat of other sites treating >> > > >> wikipedia et al as CC0. >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> WSC >> > > >> >> > > >> On 5 April 2018 at 08:04, <wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org> >> > > >> wrote: >> > > >> >> > > >> > >> > > >> > >> > > >> > >> > > >> > >> > > >> > Hi, >> > > >> > >> > > >> > On 04/04/2018 08:36 PM, Anthony Cole wrote: >> > > >> > > I'm curious also. I release my articles under "attribution, >> share >> > > >> alike" >> > > >> > > and rely on WMF to preserve those rights. >> > > >> > >> > > >> > Why are you relying on the WMF? Wikipedia contributors (like >> > yourself) >> > > >> > are the ones who own copyright to the articles - the WMF doesn't. >> > > Unless >> > > >> > you've granted/transferred copyright to the WMF (or some other >> > license >> > > >> > enforcement agreement), I don't think they can pursue legal action >> > for >> > > >> > you or other Wikipedians. (IANAL, etc.) >> > > >> > >> > > >> > -- Legoktm >> > > >> > >> > > >> > >> > > >> _______________________________________________ >> > > >> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: >> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik >> > > >> i/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik >> > > >> i/Wikimedia-l >> > > >> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org >> > > >> Unsubscribe: >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l >> > , >> > > >> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org >> ?subject=unsubscribe> >> > > >> >> > > > >> > > > >> > > _______________________________________________ >> > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/ >> > > wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/ >> > > wiki/Wikimedia-l >> > > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org >> > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, >> > > <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe> >> > > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/ >> > wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/ >> > wiki/Wikimedia-l >> > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org >> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, >> > <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> James Heilman >> MD, CCFP-EM, Wikipedian >> _______________________________________________ >> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: >> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and >> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l >> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org >> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, >> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe> > > -- > Anthony Cole > _______________________________________________ > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe> _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>
