Thanks for this response - as little content as it may have. I can totally understand it.
As I was reading the questions in this thread, I felt uneasy with the questions, because I can imagine that there are people working on these issues in our movement (whether in the WMF or not) who may have a strategy in mind where silence is more helpful. Whether Andreas is asking these questions because he wants to publish a story in the Signpost, or because he wants to help personally, I do understand that there is a general desire for more information and can't blame them for asking (as long as they in turn understand that there may not be a meaningful answer when none can be provided without harming the cause). That being said, as a community we often take the approach of trying to help. So let me ask the elephant-in-the-room question: how can we help these individual cases as a community? I think what some of the community members are trying to gauge is whether there is silence because it's considered the safer thing to do, or that it is because there are not enough resources available. I could guess the answers of course, but perhaps it would be helpful to know: - If people/affiliates have a specific concern whether someone is on your radar, where to send the message (I think this is already answered on your linked meta page: send a private email) - If people/affiliates want to help, who should they contact to know which actions are actually helpful (i.e. be quiet or make noise)? Would it be correct to assume that the community office hours would be the best venue? - I'm assuming you may have an overview page somewhere with individual cases you're actively 'making noise' about (e.g. a blog category/label). Perhaps you could link that overview from the meta page? - If the WMF sees no scenario where community involvement on this topic would be helpful, is there another organization you would recommend to look at instead? Finally, there may be some Wikimedians who have concerns whether your strategy is the right one. I'm not sure if you could speak to this, but for them it might be interesting to know whether the WMF has a standard policy to never speak about these individual cases, or will do so selectively, when it's helpful (is it ever? I assume there are such situations, but I'm no expert). Between the lines, I seem to infer that the WMF has a 'selectively' type of policy, but I also imagine that such communication would likely come from the communication team, rather than directly from the human rights team. Best, Lodewijk On Tue, Oct 3, 2023 at 3:51 PM WMF Human Rights < talktohumanrig...@wikimedia.org> wrote: > In the interest of safeguarding confidential information and ensuring the > safety of our community members, the Foundation will not publicly disclose > details regarding human rights cases. The Human Rights Team recently > updated its meta page <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Human_Rights_Team> to > clarify this approach. Our primary concern is to uphold the safety and > privacy of everyone involved. At the same time, our inability to discuss > these matters should not be read as inaction. We care deeply about > volunteer safety and our role, more generally, involves different levels of > internal support, wider advocacy and partnerships with others depending on > the circumstances of an event. > > On Tue, Oct 3, 2023 at 6:06 AM Andreas Kolbe <jayen...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Let's put it a different way then: >> >> Is anyone at the WMF doing anything in support of the two jailed Saudi >> Wikimedians, be it liaising with international or regional human rights >> organisations, the US State Department, briefing journalists so the wider >> public is aware of the situation, or anything else to make sure Osama and >> Ziyad aren't forgotten about as they start (by my calculation) their fourth >> year in jail? >> >> I am asking because the press reports published at the start of this year >> do not seem to have led to any significant coverage of the two Wikimedians' >> plight on the websites of major human rights organisations. (If I have >> missed any, please let me know.) >> >> For example, I found nothing at all on the website of Reporters without >> Borders. Similarly, the most recent Amnesty International report on the >> "crackdown on online expression" in Saudi Arabia includes several mentions >> of Twitter users but none of Wikipedians: >> >> >> https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2023/02/saudi-arabia-alarming-crackdown-on-online-expression/ >> >> Amnesty's report specifically mentions that a Twitter user was sentenced >> for supporting women's rights activist Loujain al-Hathloul but fails to >> mention that one of the jailed Wikimedians uploaded Loujain al-Hathloul's >> Commons picture, which is used in her Wikipedia articles. >> >> I didn't find anything about Osama and Ziyad or, more generally, >> Wikimedians in Saudi Arabia on the website of the EFF. >> >> There is a mention of Osama and Ziyad and the fact that they were >> Wikipedians on the PEN website: >> >> https://pen.org/report/freedom-to-write-index-2022/ >> >> The U.S. State Department's 2022 country report on Saudi Arabia, >> published in March 2023, includes a mention of Osama's 32-year prison >> sentence, but doesn't make clear that he was jailed for being a Wikipedian, >> and Ziyad is not mentioned: >> >> >> https://www.state.gov/reports/2022-country-reports-on-human-rights-practices/saudi-arabia/ >> >> Will this be remedied in the U.S. State Department's 2023 country report? >> I think each country report covers the period up to October of the >> preceding year, so this month will be the last chance to make sure the 2023 >> report published next spring will include information on Osama and Ziyad's >> prison sentences and their Wikipedia activity. >> >> Andreas >> >> >> >> On Mon, Sep 25, 2023 at 11:09 PM The Cunctator <cuncta...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >>> Frankly, that's implausible. >>> >>> On Mon, Sep 25, 2023, 3:37 PM DerHexer via Wikimedia-l < >>> wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org> wrote: >>> >>>> I do think that posting any kind of response to these questions *on a >>>> public mailing list* would do more harm than good. Thank you. >>>> >>>> Best, >>>> DerHexer >>>> *Wikimedia Steward* >>>> >>>> Am Montag, 25. September 2023 um 21:20:21 MESZ hat Andreas Kolbe < >>>> jayen...@gmail.com> Folgendes geschrieben: >>>> >>>> >>>> Dear all, >>>> >>>> As there was a recent press mention of Osama and Ziyad[1] (see "In the >>>> Media" in the current Signpost issue) – does the WMF's Human Rights Team >>>> (cc'ed) have any update on their situation? >>>> >>>> Has anyone else heard any news? If I recall correctly, Osama had >>>> married not long before being jailed in 2020 – has anyone been in touch >>>> with his wife? >>>> >>>> Is there anything the community can do? >>>> >>>> Andreas >>>> >>>> [1] >>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_imprisoned_for_editing_Wikipedia >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Wikimedia-l mailing list -- wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org, >>>> guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines >>>> and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l >>>> Public archives at >>>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/hyperkitty/list/wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org/message/CSBF3UGYR7BDU5XPYZFYQAABPXXY5PDG/ >>>> To unsubscribe send an email to wikimedia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Wikimedia-l mailing list -- wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org, >>>> guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines >>>> and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l >>>> Public archives at >>>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/hyperkitty/list/wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org/message/XMEMSGXX7XH3R7MSYZFGKR6PMRCWDDKB/ >>>> To unsubscribe send an email to wikimedia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Wikimedia-l mailing list -- wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org, guidelines >>> at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and >>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l >>> Public archives at >>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/hyperkitty/list/wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org/message/YKDNQDXMBNSD7OX6YKLN4RLJAYWC5WGO/ >>> To unsubscribe send an email to wikimedia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org >> >> _______________________________________________ > Wikimedia-l mailing list -- wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org, guidelines > at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l > Public archives at > https://lists.wikimedia.org/hyperkitty/list/wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org/message/FIAFNJ7XAKLXEAKU4MSUR7MTTWSY3IGE/ > To unsubscribe send an email to wikimedia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org
_______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list -- wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l Public archives at https://lists.wikimedia.org/hyperkitty/list/wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org/message/N6TNZYT4TBAI2DEFWC4BEVVLEVVF4VPW/ To unsubscribe send an email to wikimedia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org
