#justasking https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:WikiConference_India_2023/Team
Was this even considered ? Was the competency sought externally, missing within communities? -Regards, Mallikarjuna S J, Well-Done is better than Well-Said. - Ben Franklin. On Thu, May 4, 2023 at 6:30 PM Andreas Kolbe <jayen...@gmail.com> wrote: > Hi Bodhisattwa and all, > > You raise an interesting point – that the influx of money appears to have > a demotivating effect on Indian volunteers. This has also come up in > discussion elsewhere. > > Now I have been one of those who have urged the WMF to spend more money in > India. I have always felt that actual spending on the ground has not > matched the Foundation's fundraising messages about how money is urgently > needed to build capacity in Indian and African languages. And I have argued > that hiring staff in India, e.g., makes more sense than hiring staff in the > US, where salary expectations may run to hundreds of thousands of dollars > per year. > > How would you resolve these competing considerations? > > Regards, > Andreas (Jayen466) > > On Thu, May 4, 2023 at 3:21 AM Bodhisattwa <bodhisattwa.rg...@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> Coincidentally, just yesterday afternoon, when we were having a meeting >> in Kolkata with volunteers from West Bengal and Bangladesh, these concerns >> came up among other things. We were wondering about the visible impact of >> the increasing number of WMF staffs in India to improve our editing and >> reading experiences, significant partnership development or strengthening >> the communities in the last few years and if they have any impact at all in >> our language community to make our life easier as volunteers. >> >> Anyway, if the volunteer communities or team of organizers are not strong >> and vigilant enough, there is always a chance to get something hijacked by >> staffs. This is not new; it has happened before a number of times and it >> will happen a lot more in the future. This could not be avoided as I feel >> the spirit of volunteerism in the Indian communities is much much weaker >> than the past and dying, if not already dead in some of the cases. In the >> last few years, I have seen long term trusted community members from all >> over the country leave the movement frustrated, heart broken and exhausted, >> including from my language community. Increasing flow of unnecessary money >> are rapidly changing the motivation of volunteers with a strange notion >> prevailing nowadays that money is the solution of all problems in the >> region. Community oversight and long discussions on meta talk pages about >> any huge amount of grant proposals are now a thing of the past. But who >> cares? >> >> Unlike the previous wiki conferences, the wider Indian community did not >> get the invitation and space to actively take part in the decision making >> process from the very start of planning this conference which led to giving >> room to WMF staffs, who took over. Without community vigilance, a 3 days >> conference asked and spent 3 times more donation money than the last one >> and has set up precedences of many unwanted things which would burden >> future community programs and events in India. It's not at all surprising >> that even though no one was stopped, but a very few number of volunteers >> from my language community actually applied and participated in the >> conference, even being one of the most active community in the region. >> >> Regards, >> Bodhisattwa >> >> >> >> >> >> On Thu, May 4, 2023, 00:53 Subhashish <psubhash...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> I find this email better worded than the other one in this list a few >>> days back which was also about different issues. >>> >>> Some of these issues, though I'm not personally aware of, certainly need >>> to be addressed by WMF. >>> >>> Thank you for upholding the importance of the community by saying -- "I >>> am okay with WMF staff being paid, but it should not undermine unpaid >>> volunteers and the movement's ethos." Can't agree more. >>> >>> While I see public listing of WMF staff and contractors both on-wiki [1] >>> and the Foundation's official site, WMF staff in India might mean staff and >>> contractors who are hired both for long-term and short-term and part-time >>> roles. It could also mean those who play global roles (say, engineering >>> staffers) but reside in India and don't necessarily interface only with the >>> India-based community. Their participation in a national level event could >>> be an one-off thing. >>> >>> But those nuances apart, the volunteer and staff dynamics certainly is a >>> topic worth discussing. >>> >>> A worse social phenomenon in India is a foreigner being treated with >>> more dignity than a local. The intersectionality of caste, gender, fluency >>> in English, intergenerational privilege and many other social factors play >>> a role. I still think this is not a standalone issue and should be >>> discussed (and investigated if needed) keeping in mind the >>> intersectionality. >>> >>> 1. https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Wikimedia_Foundation_staff >>> >>> Subha >>> >>> On Wed, May 3, 2023, 11:09 PM Jayantilal Kothari < >>> jayantilal...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Dear Maryana Iskander and Wikimedia Foundation, >>>> >>>> I hope this email finds you well. I am writing to request more >>>> transparency about the roles and responsibilities of WMF staff in India. I >>>> am assuming good faith and believe that any issues arising are >>>> unintentional; however, these occurrences seem to be negatively impacting >>>> the overall movement. >>>> >>>> It has come to my attention that WMF allocates a relatively small >>>> amount of funds to the Indian community. This implies that a significant >>>> portion of donor money is spent on staff, making it crucial to ensure that >>>> donors and the Wiki community are aware of how the funds are being utilized >>>> and the impact generated. >>>> >>>> Firstly, I have noticed that WMF hires non-community staff members who >>>> may be initially unfamiliar with the Wikimedia community and movement in >>>> general. This is not an issue as long as newly recruited staff members are >>>> willing to work collaboratively with the community, rather than competing >>>> with them. Unfortunately, there have been instances where this has not been >>>> the case, such as WMF India staff paying Instagram users without consulting >>>> the community, and the recent WikiConference India, where WMF staff >>>> overshadowed volunteer committees and took over volunteer roles during >>>> conference planning. >>>> >>>> Initially, I thought that privacy concerns might be the reason behind >>>> the lack of transparency. However, during the recent conference, I observed >>>> that such staff members were comfortable being on stage and being >>>> identified as WMF Staff amongst friends from the industry whom they invited >>>> to the conference. It appears that more people from the industry are aware >>>> of WMF India staff's existence than the community itself. Some staff >>>> members were keen to take credit for the entire movement and even >>>> conference planning in front of the volunteer community and friends from >>>> the industry. It might help and advance the careers of WMF India staff by >>>> showcasing WikiConference India on their resumes, but the main purpose of >>>> such community events is to give a chance to community leadership and to >>>> celebrate unpaid community members. I am okay with WMF staff being paid, >>>> but it should not undermine unpaid volunteers and the movement's ethos. >>>> >>>> The Wiki community looks up to WMF staff for support, but now there is >>>> a fear that WMF staff may hijack community programs and stages, with >>>> WikiConference India being a recent example. >>>> >>>> There seems to be a lot of mystery surrounding the roles and >>>> responsibilities of WMF India staff members and their interactions with >>>> volunteer communities. The Wiki community is dedicated to the mission and >>>> will continue to thrive even without WMF staff. I believe it is crucial for >>>> WMF to publicly share the roles, responsibilities, and outcomes of the WMF >>>> India staff over the last few years. This transparency will enable >>>> community members and donors to appreciate the efforts of WMF India staff, >>>> as currently, the impact of their work remains unknown. >>>> >>>> I kindly request that WMF provides a list of all WMF India staff >>>> members and their achievements, so we can celebrate their accomplishments >>>> and collaborate with them more effectively. >>>> >>>> Looking forward to your response. >>>> >>>> With Regards, >>>> Jayantilal >>>> -- >>>> Regards, >>>> >>>> Jayantilal >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Wikimediaindia-l mailing list -- wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org >>>> To unsubscribe send an email to >>>> wikimediaindia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org >>>> To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit >>>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/postorius/lists/wikimediaindia-l.lists.wikimedia.org/ >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Wikimediaindia-l mailing list -- wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org >>> To unsubscribe send an email to >>> wikimediaindia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org >>> To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit >>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/postorius/lists/wikimediaindia-l.lists.wikimedia.org/ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Wikimediaindia-l mailing list -- wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org >> To unsubscribe send an email to >> wikimediaindia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org >> To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/postorius/lists/wikimediaindia-l.lists.wikimedia.org/ > > _______________________________________________ > Wikimediaindia-l mailing list -- wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe send an email to wikimediaindia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit > https://lists.wikimedia.org/postorius/lists/wikimediaindia-l.lists.wikimedia.org/
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