What if you need wayside T1s or need four VLAN capable GigE ports? Or have several hundred or a thousand feet between the antenna and radio room? Or what if many of your sites already have LMR400 run and replacing or adding cable isn't optimum due to labor costs or increased roof lease costs? It sure is easier to swap out an old PCOM, DMC, Dragonwave or Ceragon radio with a Giga that uses the same cable than an Apex that requires a new cable.
To simply state that if you are using 18Ghz then use the Apex over the Giga is ridiculous at best. There are many applications where the Apex is not as good a fit as the Giga. Brad -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, November 28, 2008 12:18 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Apex If you are using 18GHz, you should use the Apex line. It will offer up to 366Mbps and is a little cheaper. On Fri, Nov 28, 2008 at 12:12 PM, Travis Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Daniel, > > I just got a quote back from Trango for the following: > > 18ghz (311Mbps full-duplex) with split IDU/ODU > 2ft dishes > 48v rack mount power supplies > > Total price = $9,800 > > Care to share the pricing on a Dragonwave for the same? > > Travis > Microserv > > > 3-dB Networks wrote: > > I guess that's a personal preference. I've installed way more > > Stratex/Ceragon/Dragonwave links using the voltmeter design and probably > > just prefer it that way. > > > > > > > > And yes 5 months ago there might have been a difference when the gear was > on > > sale from Trango and before Dragonwave dropped its pricing. I just did > this > > the other day with a customer. I was able to match Trango for the same > > throughput > > > > Daniel White > > 3-dB Networks > > > > _____ > > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On > > Behalf Of Travis Johnson > > Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2008 7:40 AM > > To: WISPA General List > > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Apex > > > > > > > > Hi, > > > > Having used the "voltmeter" vs. LED method of aligning, I will take the > LED > > any day. One less piece of equipment to have to deal with on the tower, > and > > a much more accurate way to see the true RSSI on the link. > > > > And, I think we already did the "pricing" thing about 5 months ago, > didn't > > we? Seems like the Dragonwave was about $3,000 more for less of a > radio... > > ;) > > > > Travis > > Microserv > > > > 3-dB Networks wrote: > > > > Tom, > > > > Quick question, then my response... do all Apex's ship with the fiber > port > > in them? > > > > I really have to bite my tounge... I don't want to get into what all > > happened (basically I don't want my thoughts made public and the customer > I > > was working for to read them) but I was not impressed at all with the > Trango > > Giga product... I just helped install nine links last week. All I did > was > > install and configure the radios, so yes they said 256QAM at 3xx Meg... > but > > I didn't get to test it with live data, etc. > > > > What I will say, the alignment LED is a gimmick. Give me a BNC connector > > hooked up to a voltmeter any day. First my voltmeter is going to read to > > decimals, which is very helpful aligning long links. Second, the LED is > > about worthless if the sun is shining on it, you have to cover it with > your > > hands to read the numbers which was difficult on at least one link I was > > aligning. Third, positioning on some towers to align the link made > reading > > the LED difficult. None of these issues are problems with my voltmeter, > I > > simply just use a strip of electrical tape and tape it to the ODU where I > > want. > > > > One thing I did like, the handles on the ODU of the Giga. Made aligning > 3ft > > dishes a bit easier... > > > > With all of that said, what is the price on the Apex now that the summer > > special is long over? Before jumping for Trango, I would encourage > anyone > > to show me a current quote and to see if I can match it with > Dragonwave... > > from what I understand I can come damn close :-) > > > > Daniel White > > 3-dB Networks > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On > > Behalf Of Tom DeReggi > > Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2008 12:38 AM > > To: WISPA General List > > Subject: [WISPA] Trango Apex > > > > Not sure how many of you have tried the new Trango Apexes yet, but I > thought > > > > I'd share my recent experience.... > > > > OK.... 366mbps, 256QAM, Cost me much less than I was expecting. And.... > it > > just freakin Worked! > > WooHoo! Man, I like this radio. > > > > I specificaly liked the fact that the all outdoor unit, comes with 3 > ports, > > 1 fiber, 1 GigE, 1 out-of-band managemnet, and supports inband management > on > > > > the GigE. > > What I thought was unique was that either of the two Ethernet ports could > be > > > > used to provide the POE power input. And also optionally can just run > > stanrdard Electrical wire to the Molex connector instead if prefer. But > I > > was extremely impressed at the flexibilty in options to install this. The > > alignment LED is also awesome, that is positioned in a convenient place > and > > shows actual RSSI DB number, as it really speeds up install and made it > > possible for one person to accurately align it. > > > > Also note... The older Giga had some anoying firmware bugs last year in > > their Betas (typical of Beta), and I finally got around to upgrading to > the > > latest firmwares. (I was 9 months overdue for the task) Guess what... All > > the problems are FIXED!! Atleast the ones I knew about. I was really > > pleased. I have to say this product line is REALLY coming along nicely. > > > > Only thing I caution to be aware of is.... It takes a while to fully > > understand the relationship of how well your link is performing in > relation > > to what the MSE value of the radio is. MSE is the equivellent of > > measurement of SNR and distortion. And the ATPC and Adaptive Modulation > > thresholds are based on specific MSEs reached. The MSE feature/meter > works > > good and accurately, it was just an issue of understanding how to > > interperate it. > > > > I was also impreseed on how fast they associate when they are taking out > of > > opmode and back on in opmode. Its super quick. > > > > Tom DeReggi > > RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc > > IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Butch Evans" <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> < > [EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > To: "WISPA General List" <mailto:wireless@wispa.org> < > wireless@wispa.org> > > Sent: Monday, November 24, 2008 11:45 PM > > Subject: Re: [WISPA] WiMax delays? > > > > > > > > > > On Mon, 24 Nov 2008, Travis Johnson wrote: > > > > > > > > I don't think this is entirely true. For us, it becomes a "value" > > decision. If there was an AP that would deliver 100Mbps and could > > support 1000 subscribers, I would be willing to pay $10,000+ for it > > today. There is a real "gap" in the products that are available on > > the market: > > > > > > I don't disagree with your assessment of the current product matrix. > > I don't even assume that ALL WISPs are "cheap". I am not sure I > > would say that even MOST of them are cheap. But enough of them are > > that the middle of the road products you want are missing in action. > > > > > > > > Next = Mikrotik > > Next = Trango, Canopy, etc > > > > > > Since they have fixed their wireless, I'd put MT in the same class > > as Trango and Canopy. > > > > > > > > So, again, why hasn't there been an evolution of products the last > > 2-3 years? Did everyone stop normal R&D to focus on WiMax? > > > > > > I have an opinion (which I stated in rant form) about what happened > > to the R&D. The Canopy line (which is a very nice radio) is a good > > example. Motorola has delivered a product that just works. It is > > expensive compared to other products sold to the same "marketplace", > > but it is NOT expensive for what it delivers. Better, yet, they are > > working to make a new product line that will improve upon what is > > available today. But their primary market isn't the "normal" WISP. > > They service companies that are better funded, which typically means > > larger WISPs, cable companies and telcos. > > > > I really hope I didn't offend anyone with my rant. It wasn't > > intended to do that. I really just wish our industry as a whole > > would get out of the hole that we have dug with the "cheaper is > > better" mindframe. > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
