Yeah, they're bad. Trust me. When we very first started using MT that was all that was available. They're total garbage.
On Thu, Dec 3, 2009 at 9:01 AM, <os10ru...@gmail.com> wrote: > I know some special purpose plastic enclosures made for RF work have > conductive/shielding qualities to them. There's even conductive/shielding > paint one can buy for RF projects. So those plastic boxes might not be as > bad as you think. > > Greg > > > On Dec 3, 2009, at 10:50 AM, Josh Luthman wrote: > > > More along the lines of plastic enclosures versus metal enclosures. > > > > Josh Luthman > > Office: 937-552-2340 > > Direct: 937-552-2343 > > 1100 Wayne St > > Suite 1337 > > Troy, OH 45373 > > > > "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources." > > --- Albert Einstein > > > > > > On Thu, Dec 3, 2009 at 10:47 AM, Robert West <robert.w...@just-micro.com > >wrote: > > > >> Plastic next to the antennas??? CRAZY! So the radios pretty much talk > to > >> themselves a lot, huh. Hearing voices in their heads......... > >> > >> > >> > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > >> Behalf Of Jayson Baker > >> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 10:36 PM > >> To: WISPA General List > >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Multiple Radio cards in an enclosure > >> > >> I have to laugh at one of our competitors who uses PLASTIC enclosures > next > >> to their antennas on the tower. Even on the most RF-jam packed sites. > One > >> site in particular you can almost get a fluorescent light to glow just > >> holding it in your hands. And there they are with their plastic > >> enclosures. And can't figure out why their system sucks ass. > >> > >> Oh well. They burned us for over $100k in consulting fees and > equipment. > >> It makes me laugh everytime I see it. > >> > >> On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 8:30 PM, Marlon K. Schafer > >> <o...@odessaoffice.com>wrote: > >> > >>> I've given up on this. There is just too much cross talk. I put all > >>> radios > >>> in the same band in their own METAL enclosure nowadays. I try to keep > >> them > >>> at least 3 or 6 feet apart too. Life is much much nicer. > >>> marlon > >>> > >>> ----- Original Message ----- > >>> From: "Mike" <m...@aweiowa.com> > >>> To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org> > >>> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 8:13 AM > >>> Subject: [WISPA] Multiple Radio cards in an enclosure > >>> > >>> > >>>> Since I am probably one of the veterans called out yesterday for my > >>>> messaging etiquette, I am changing the subject. > >>>> > >>>> I am interested in the multiple radios in an enclosure idea. I do > >>>> have a couple with 5.8 and 2.4 gear in the same box, but have been > >>>> afraid to put cards in the same band in the same case. > >>>> > >>>> The foil spacer you put between cards Bob, do you then ground it to > >>>> create a sort of Faraday shield? I know the XRx cards do a good job > >>>> of shielding if you attach the pigtail. > >>>> > >>>> How about the receive sensitivity on the 411 cards? Has that been an > >>>> issue? I think the XR cards have better specs. Wouldn't having > >>>> multiple 411 cards in the same box possibly have desense issues too? > >>>> > >>>> Mike > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> At 09:41 AM 12/2/2009, you wrote: > >>>>> Forgot to add, if you're concerned with any RF collisions inside the > >> box, > >>>>> the other thing I talked about earlier, having just 3 411 cards in > >> their > >>>>> own > >>>>> box at the sector then running Cat5 to transparent bridge the 411's > to > >> a > >>>>> central RouterOS device would take any of that issue totally away. > >>> That's > >>>>> one that I'm doing just to do it, basically. Was an idea from > someone > >> a > >>>>> couple of months ago. (I actually listen to you guys) Had a 600a > >> doing > >>>>> nothing and some 411 cards "so why not play?" was my thinking. > >>>>> > >>>>> Bob- > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] > >> On > >>>>> Behalf Of Mike > >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 9:48 AM > >>>>> To: WISPA General List > >>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Sectors > >>>>> > >>>>> Have you had any issues with putting 3 radio cards in the same > >>>>> spectrum in the same box? I've thought about that but wondered if > >>>>> there would be desense issues where one transmitting desensitizes > >>>>> another one listening. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> At 08:38 AM 12/2/2009, you wrote: > >>>>>> Yep, looks like you're hitting the wall. We aren't lucky enough to > >>> push > >>>>>> 3 > >>>>>> meg here, the most is usually 1 so again, all depends on your > >> customer > >>>>> base. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> I'd say if you already have 35 on that one AP, just splitting it > into > >> 2 > >>>>>> 180 > >>>>>> degree sectors will just cost you cash as soon as you gain a few > more > >>>>>> customers. You already have 35 pulling it down, sounds like if you > >>> just > >>>>>> do > >>>>>> 2 180's, if split evenly (and it never will be) that would put you > to > >>>>>> where > >>>>>> you probably want to be for smooth delivery but not much room for > >> more > >>>>>> growth. I'd go with 3 120's and a 433AH with 3 cards on it, one per > >>>>> sector. > >>>>>> I have a few like that and it works fine for what I do but again, I > >>> only > >>>>>> dole out 1mb per sub typically. I've also been upgrading some of my > >>>>>> remote > >>>>>> AP's to one 433AH with only one radio installed and an Omni. The > >>>>>> anticipated upgrade path is to just add a sector or 2 and radio card > >> as > >>>>>> needed to the point where I have 3 sectors. Keeping the Omni of > >> course > >>>>>> until the third sector is needed. That's something someone already > >>>>>> suggested doing and I like the economics of it. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Bob- > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org > ] > >>> On > >>>>>> Behalf Of Jason Hensley > >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 9:26 AM > >>>>>> To: 'WISPA General List' > >>>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Sectors > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Max 3meg - b only mode on this particular AP. Most are still able > to > >>>>>> get > >>>>>> that, but we're seeing a decline on how many can pull 3meg. At peak > >>>>>> times, > >>>>>> we've seen it to where users aren't able to get much over 1meg, but > >>>>>> that's > >>>>>> not happening very often right now. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org > ] > >>> On > >>>>>> Behalf Of Robert West > >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 8:23 AM > >>>>>> To: 'WISPA General List' > >>>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Sectors > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Yeah, how much bandwidth are you passing to those 35 customers, > >> Jason? > >>>>> Just > >>>>>> curious. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Bob- > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org > ] > >>> On > >>>>>> Behalf Of os10ru...@gmail.com > >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 9:10 AM > >>>>>> To: WISPA General List > >>>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Sectors > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Do you think you're hitting the limit of 802.11b/g or is it the lack > >> of > >>>>>> horsepower on the AP's CPU? > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Greg > >>>>>> On Dec 2, 2009, at 8:33 AM, Jason Hensley wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>>> On this same subject, would it be better to put up 3 individual > >>> AP's, > >>>>>>> or > >>>>>>> would something like the Deliberant Quad work well if the issue is > >>> AP > >>>>>>> overload. I have an AP that has 35 subscribers right now. We've > >>>>>>> seen a > >>>>>>> performance drop on it and are considering sectoring. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Any thoughts on a dual (or quad) radio on a single board vs > >> multiple > >>>>>> boards > >>>>>>> with single radios? > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>>>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto: > >> wireless-boun...@wispa.org > >>> ] > >>>>>>> On > >>>>>>> Behalf Of Rick Harnish > >>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 6:28 AM > >>>>>>> To: 'WISPA General List' > >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Sectors > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Mark, > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> If I remember right, you are in Missouri. I was looking for the > >>>>> strength > >>>>>> of > >>>>>>> your omni. We have had good success with 9 db omni's in the > >> Indiana > >>>>>>> farmland. When we need to sectorize but the market capacity is > >> not > >>>>>>> that > >>>>>>> high, we often go to (2) 180 Superpass 9 db sectors. We have had > >>>>>>> good > >>>>>> luck > >>>>>>> with them over the years. They improve our signal to existing > >>>>>>> clients > >>>>> and > >>>>>>> enable affordable expansion in rural areas. If the market will > >>>>>>> justify > >>>>> 3 > >>>>>>> sectors, I would go that way though. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Many of our Wireless POPs are pico-cells and we try to limit our > >>>>> salesmen > >>>>>> to > >>>>>>> a 6 mile diameter around the tower. Although, we can often go > >>>>>>> farther, > >>>>> we > >>>>>>> try to stay inside these guidelines when possible. To achieve a > >> high > >>>>>> density > >>>>>>> of broadcast stations, many locations are needed. Luckily, we are > >>>>>>> well > >>>>>>> established in our area and have most of these sites already in > >>>>> operation. > >>>>>>> Your mileage may vary given your topology and broadcast site > >>> density. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Rick Harnish > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>>>>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto: > >>> wireless-boun...@wispa.org] > >>>>>>>> On > >>>>>>>> Behalf Of Mark McElvy > >>>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, December 01, 2009 10:51 PM > >>>>>>>> To: WISPA General List > >>>>>>>> Subject: [WISPA] Sectors > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> I am running 2.4 HPOL It has taken about 1.5 yrs to grow this AP > >> to > >>>>>>>> 32 > >>>>>>>> subs. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>>>>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto: > >>> wireless-boun...@wispa.org] > >>>>>>>> On > >>>>>>>> Behalf Of 3-dB Networks > >>>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, December 01, 2009 9:37 PM > >>>>>>>> To: 'WISPA General List' > >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Sectors > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> What frequency band and polarization? > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> I would also strongly consider your reasoning for moving from the > >>>>>>>> Omni > >>>>>>>> to > >>>>>>>> the sectors. If it is because your AP is overloaded so you need > >> to > >>>>>>>> offload > >>>>>>>> some, 3 AP's might be attractive for future proofing sakes. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Daniel White > >>>>>>>> 3-dB Networks > >>>>>>>> http://www.3dbnetworks.com > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>>>>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto: > >>> wireless-boun...@wispa.org] > >>>>>>>> On > >>>>>>>> Behalf Of Mark McElvy > >>>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, December 01, 2009 8:29 PM > >>>>>>>> To: WISPA General List > >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Sectors > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> 9db > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>>>>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto: > >>> wireless-boun...@wispa.org] > >>>>>>>> On > >>>>>>>> Behalf Of Rick Harnish > >>>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, December 01, 2009 7:42 PM > >>>>>>>> To: 'WISPA General List' > >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Sectors > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> What size omni are you using? > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>>>>>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org > >>>>>>>>> [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] > >>>>>>>> On > >>>>>>>>> Behalf Of Josh Luthman > >>>>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, December 01, 2009 7:59 PM > >>>>>>>>> To: WISPA General List > >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Sectors > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> That is the general suggestion - two 120s. That one guy that > >> does > >>>>>>>>> antenna design said so :) > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> You will get some less coverage then three 120s but at the cost > >> of > >>>>>>>> the > >>>>>>>>> extra radio/antenna it isn't cost efficient. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> On 12/1/09, Mark McElvy <mmce...@accubak.com> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>> I need to sector a tower that currently is an omni. I don't > >>>>>>>>>> really > >>>>>>>>> want > >>>>>>>>>> to go to 3x 120's but find it hard to find 180's and have heard > >>>>>>>> they > >>>>>>>>>> don't tend to work great. I have also heard 2x 120's will work, > >>>>>>>>>> any > >>>>>>>>>> comments? > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> Mark > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>>>>>>>> ----------- > >>>>>>>>>> WISPA Wants You! 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