3. Programmers, who almost unanimously seem to treat the inevitable HTML
output of their web apps with contempt, or at best, as an afterthought.
In my world I am starting to win the battle with developers. For us the
fundamental change was to move the ASP.NET developers away from the use
of Grid
layout and use more of a flow view. Yes this will not fix the problem
of invalid
documents entirely. But it makes that seperation of the presentation
layer that
much more clear and distinct
Matthew Barben | Piggles Web Development
Phone: 0419 206 112
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Web: http://www.piggles.net
Quoting Kevin Futter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
I would posit that this association of poor markup and table-based design
has more to do with a certain approach to web development than merely a
raised risk of error in using table-based design. What I mean by that is
that most designers/developers who are entrenched in the table-based
approach are "old skool", knowing nothing of standards-based approaches, or
dismissing them as unnecessary. This mindset also tends to treat HTML with
disdain, and the vast majority of designers/developers under this umbrella
fall into 1 of 3 categories:
1. Hacks who have been asked to produce websites for their
company/department in the absence of a qualified professional;
2. "Old skool" warriors whose hard-earned table-based hacks are just too
entrenched to let go of;
3. Programmers, who almost unanimously seem to treat the inevitable HTML
output of their web apps with contempt, or at best, as an afterthought.
The practical upshot of this is that they don't care, or know enough to
care, that their markup is invalid, and will always argue that "it works".
I think the key here - and I know this was the case for me - is getting them
to understand the semantic value of their markup, more so than the simple
binary opposition of "tables vs css". Being inspired to strip away all the
crap is the natural and inevitable result of the semantics light bulb coming
on in someone's head. Then they realise that it's not an arbitrary debate
about style or best practise, but about efficient and effective information
architecture and delivery.
Hope all that made sense!
Kevin
On 7/9/05 10:24 AM, "John Allsopp" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
And the location of the overwhelming percentage of these
malformations is in and around tables.
So the use of tables appears to be associated strongly with invalid
documents (and not only through poorly formed documents, but also
through the use of invalid attributes associated with td and tr
elements).
In short, using tables is a very good way of raising the risk of
invalid documents.
--
Kevin Futter
Webmaster, St. Bernard's College
http://www.sbc.melb.catholic.edu.au/
******************************************************
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list & getting help
******************************************************
******************************************************
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list & getting help
******************************************************
