----- Original Message -----
From: "Kimbro Staken" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 5:05 PM
Subject: Re: XML-RPC and moving on...


>
> On Monday, March 11, 2002, at 06:02 AM, James Bates wrote:
>
> > I'll try out this setEncoding() method in XML-RPC. If it works, that
> > would be great.
> >
> > That would allow us at least to garantee remote Java support. Remote
> > clients should still be disuaded then from connecting through XML-RPC,
as
> > no garantee can be made that that remote client will understand the
> > UTTF-8, as the spec doesn't allow for it.
> >
>
> We can't assume UTF-8 at all anyway because many languages simply don't
> support it. We have no control over that, so I don't consider it a major
> stumbling block.
>
> We really have two separate issues here.
> 1. What API do we use internal to the system?
> 2. What API do we make available to other languages?
>
> For 1. I'm currently -0 on using SOAP. I don't think we need it, we'll be
> able to make XML-RPC work just fine even if we need to base64 the strings.

+1  SOAP certainly seems too bloated to be used internally.

> For 2. Whether it is XML-RPC or SOAP really doesn't matter that much. In
> fact, in my opinion, we should expose both at some point. Let's not get
> too caught up in worrying about this right now. Let's get the core system
> off of CORBA and just expose a very simple network API to start. If it
can'
> t be fully UTF-8 in every language, so be it, we can't control that
anyway.
>   Right now I'm +1 for focusing on XML-RPC here too. I'd like to keep
> things as simple as possible, SOAP can come later and can be focused as a
> purely external API.

> > On the other hand, I've also started using SOAP here for something else,
> > and it seems pretty cool... I use Apache AXIS to do all the work and
> > although it's still in alpha developmenmt stage, it seems to work really
> > well (haven't really encountered any issues yet, even using Micro$oft VB
> > clients...)
> >
> > I think in any case, you first need a Java server-side API that is
> > "RPC-able", as neither SOAP or XML-RPC really have support for "remote
> > objects", the way CORBA or RMI do. The current server API still would
> > require remote objects. Once this API has been made (i.e. only
> > serializable objects are used as parameters and return values in
methods)
> > , making SOAP or XML-RPC of it should be a matter of applying the tools
> > provided with either the XML-RPC or SOAP toolkit...
>
> This is right, we just need a very simple API, let's just forget about any
> kind of distributed object design. The current CORBA API is an overly
> complex design.
>
> What I'd like to see is an API that basically exposes two sets of
> functionality. One highly simple for general clients and one slightly more
> complex for use internal in the system. The simple API would be built on
> top of the more complex API. I really hate the idea of adding this
> complexity, but we really need it to enable more efficient use on the
> client using the XML:DB API. For instance we should really be parsing
> documents for insertion as part of the client API rather then handing it
> to the server. There are several reasons for this, off loading the server,
>   DTD resolution and enabling more features of the parser i.e schema
> support. All of this is MUCH easier if done on the client. In
> communications with the server we just pass around the compressed byte
> array and symbols used internally by the server.
>
> There are several ways we can expose this.
>
> 1. Separate endpoints
> 2. Overridden methods
> 3. Extra parameters on methods.
>
> I believe 1. is probably the most robust and least polluted method. For
> instance with 2. it could be difficult to distinguish some methods and 3.
> clutters the entire interface.
>
> So for instance we could have
>
> getDocument(String collection, String id)
>
> That returns a string in the simple interface and returns a struct
> containing the necessary pieces of the compressed document in the complex
> interface.

Separate endpoints is definitely the way to go.

Kurt

> Is someone planning to propose an API design?
>
> >
> >
> > James
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: Kurt Ward [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >> Sent: 10 March 2002 01:00
> >> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >> Subject: XML-RPC and moving on...
> >>
> >>
> >> XML-RPC:
> >>
> >> I don't really remember where we left off on the discussion about
> >> using XML-RPC on the internals and on the external interface, but
> >> I've been doing some work with Apache XML-RPC and found
> >> that it does in fact allow for UTF-8 encoding by calling
> >>
> >> XmlRpc.setEncoding("UTF8");
> >>
> >> I haven't dug into enough XML-RPC client implementations to
> >> see how many also support UTF-8, but I'm assuming that probably
> >> most do (?).
> >>
> >> Moving on:
> >>
> >> Where/how/who do we go from here?  I'm still a little gun-shy to
> >> tear into the internals right now until I have some more time
> >> to become
> >> more familiar with the existing code.  I guess what I'd like
> >> to see is the
> >> list that Kimbro came up with a while back with some priorities, etc..
> >>
> >> Kurt
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> _________________________________________________________
> >> Do You Yahoo!?
> >> Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> Kimbro Staken - http://www.kstaken.org - http://www.xmldatabases.org
> Apache Xindice native XML database http://xml.apache.org/xindice
> XML:DB Initiative http://www.xmldb.org
> Senior Technologist (Your company name here)


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