That, of course, is the clear argument for Windows as a workstation OS, and I agree 100% in that sense (Mac OS X is great also). However, when it comes to server management, I prefer people I work with (and myself) to be knowledgeable, and I prefer the OS to be as flexible as possible. This is just my experience, I am not presenting it as an absolute truth for everyone, but I have found that at best the Windows GUI does nothing to help understanding or flexibility, and at worst it creates IT people who don't understand the internals behind what they are doing and rigid GUI behavior that makes it more difficult (or even impossible) to create poweful non-commercial or non-standard solutions to complex problems.
So, with a workstation, ease of use is extermely high on my list of importance, and with servers ease of use is extremely low on my list of importantance. But that's just me... And no, I don't know of any Linux solutions as complete as Windows from a graphical standpoint - there are a few good starts, though (Red Hat seemed pretty good, but not up to the Windows standard). However, I won't know about any that do get developed because that doesn't much interest me in a server OS - I'll take the road of having to understand the internals a bit so that there is no problem fixing it or making it work later. That is what I like about XMail - it is hardly a standard Windows application and certainly defies the "comprehensive and consistent GUI" that Windows provides, but it is powerful, rock solid and fast. I'll take it over Exchange (when possible - it doesn't have all the functionality) any day, and Apache (or Xitami or a bunch of others) over IIS, even when running Windows OS, despite the relative hassle of setting them up the same way you might on a UNIX or Linux platform. Francis, I enjoy the discussion - if you want, please feel free to mail me any responses directly so that we don't have to burden others who are probably tired of this ancient discussion! It probably doesn't really belong on this mailing list... My email address is [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jeff CLEMENT Francis wrote: >Just to say that for me, free os will win the battle, especially >in small business and finaly at home, only when a comprehensive, >easy to use, complete admin gui will be available for use by >anyone without big knowledge. >This will help a lot ... > >Computers must be easy to use. > >The big point for windows is that it is easy to use, easy to >manage/configure ... >All tools are gui, all are consistent in use, ... > >Is there a complete managment tool for linux ? > >Francis > > > >>-----Message d'origine----- >>De : Jeff Buehler [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >>Envoyé : mercredi 22 juin 2005 19:36 >>À : xmail@xmailserver.org >>Objet : [xmail] Re: Help Xscanner >> >> >> >>However, ASSP (nor ClamSMTP nor ClamAV) do not run on Windows. There >>are, of course, other solutions, but this combination is the >>best I have >>found for the price (or any price, although the high-priced >>commercial >>market is not really my expertise). I'm honestly trying to help Yann >>come up with an ideal solution for what it sounds like his >>problem may >>be, not push idealogy. >> >>Speaking of idealogy, I think a lot of people choose Windows >>because of >>comfort and familiarity, which are really not the best >>reasons to make >>server based decisions (or arguably most reasonably complex IT >>decisions), but I acknowledge that this is an opinion and not a clear >>fact. I also run two Windows servers simply because I need them to >>debug IT problems for clients, so I use them as test beds for >>changes I >>intend or need to make to client systems. I am at a loss as to why >>someone would want a (very) expensive operating system for a >>server when >>free ones are available that perform at least as well (oh, >>wait, I know, >>Exchange and Active Directory - yay!). Not an argument, just >>an opinion >>from my experience. Bill certainly doesn't need the income. >> >>Thanks for the reminder not to start any wars! Certainly never my >>intention - there are enough ridiculous wars around without >>my help (um, >>I hope that doesn't start another discussion!) >> >> >>Jeff >> >> >> >>CLEMENT Francis wrote: >> >> >> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>>-----Message d'origine----- >>>>De : Jeff Buehler [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>>Envoyé : mercredi 22 juin 2005 18:30 >>>>À : xmail@xmailserver.org >>>>Objet : [xmail] Re: Help Xscanner >>>> >>>> >>>>If you have a SPAM problem, I would advise the following >>>>configuration: >>>> >>>>1. Dump windows. Ubiquitous != good. Install Linux or FreeeBSD. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>>this may seem a bit elaborate, but in my opinion Windows is >>>>really not ideal >>>>(unstable, not too scaleable, not free) for running a mail >>>>server. I found >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>My xmail 'windows' server runs good from xmail 0.96 to xmail >>> >>> >>1.21 now and >> >> >>>never restarted nor bugged ;-) >>>(except for standard maintenance) >>>I have too some FreeBSD running well too ... >>>Badly configured Linux/FreeBSD/... equal badly configured >>> >>> >>windows too .... >> >> >>>Don't be soo partial ;-) Well configured Windows equals well >>> >>> >>configured >> >> >>>linux or others >>>It's not really on these arguments that free software will win ... >>> >>>So don't start a war again please ... >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>>Spam Assassin works well for anti-spam purposes, but it's a >>>>little bit CPU >>>>intensive relative to ASSP in my experience. I'm sorry but I >>>>can't help you >>>>with the doList filter, although at first look doList seems >>>>to be a pretty >>>>weak anti-spam solution - it's just a filter without Bayesian >>>>analysis or >>>>anything. >>>> >>>>Jeff >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>My one experience on spam battle : >>>Run Xmail (one your os of choice, just configure the os >>> >>> >>correctly ...) >> >> >>>Add it Davide's excellent GLST filter >>>Add it a good virus scanner (av-filter from Dario, henry.it, >>> >>> >>with fprot or >> >> >>>nai) >>> >>>At this time, you eliminate 99% spams without big >>>cpu/software/harware/config... >>>This is approximatively the result I found after 2 months with this >>>configuration >>>(we are hosters, with a good number of mails coming in every day) >>> >>>Francis >>> >>>- >>>To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe xmail" in >>>the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>For general help: send the line "help" in the body of a message to >>>[EMAIL PROTECTED] >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>- >>To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe xmail" in >>the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>For general help: send the line "help" in the body of a message to >>[EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >> >> >- >To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe xmail" in >the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] >For general help: send the line "help" in the body of a message to >[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe xmail" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line "help" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
