Anthony,
Rinzai. Rinzai. Rinzai.
The reason I sometimes spell it with an 'e' is I've always heard it pronouced
'ren-zai' ('ren' as in 'render'). I would pronouce 'rin-zai' as ('rin' =
'Rin-Tin-Tin').
I will try to remember the correct spelling. Thanks.
...Bill!
--- In [email protected], Anthony Wu <wuasg@...> wrote:
>
> Bill,
> Â
> So, you are saying that halting a dicriminating mind is a criterion of
> calling an experience Buddha Nature. That makes sense. We should not rule out
> there are other types of experiences that also make you feel good, such as
> union with the universe, even the ecstacy arising from Tantric rituals. That
> makes the world colorful.
> Â
> On the other hand, if you continue to say RENZAI, I will increase the caning
> reserved for you from one to two.
> Â
> Remember, it is RINZAIÂ !!
> Â
> Anthony
>
>
> --- On Mon, 27/6/11, billsmart <BillSmart@...> wrote:
>
>
> From: billsmart <BillSmart@...>
> Subject: Re: [Zen] Why Practice Chan?
> To: [email protected]
> Date: Monday, 27 June, 2011, 11:01 AM
>
>
> Â
>
>
>
> Zendervish,
>
> You asked:
> > How would you know if you experienced "Buddha Nature?"
>
> That's a good question. I posted an answer to this but then deleted it
> realizing it was insufficient. In that post I used an analogy of experiencing
> 'hot' when touching fire, but that was really not a good example. I'll still
> use the examples of fire and Buddha nature to answer your question but in a
> slightly different way.
>
> *** FIRE ***
>
> When I touch fire I have a sensory experience. When you touch fire you have a
> sensory experience. I don't really know if my experience and your experience
> are exactly the same, but I assume it is.
>
> When I touch fire my reaction might be 'Ouch!' When you touch fire your
> reaction might be 'Oo-wee!', or sticking your fingers in your mouth. Our
> initial reactions are pre-thinking, pre-intellect.
>
> THIS IS THE END OF THE EXPERIENCE - what follows below is Maya (illusory):
>
> If this was the first time we have ever had this experience we might then
> think, 'What was that?', and make a judgement 'That felt bad', and categorize
> the experience, 'Touching fire is dangerous'. We may want to describe our
> experience to others, 'bad', 'pain', 'intense' and eventually give it a name,
> 'hot' or 'burn'.
>
> On the other hand if we had heard about or read about a description of an
> experience that seemed the same as this one, and knew a name for that
> experience was 'burn', we might just adopt that name and describe our
> experience as 'burn', and assume it was the same as the 'burn' described by
> others.
>
> Maybe someone who had never touched fire or had the experience named 'burn'
> touches dry ice. That person would experience much the same things as the
> person who touched fire, and that person might beleive that by touching dry
> ice he has experienced 'burn'. Someone else hearing this account may reject
> that and say this person had not experience 'burn' because he did not touch
> fire, but touched dry ice and declare this 'burn' experience invalid or at
> least mis-identified.
>
> *** BUDDHA NATURE ***
>
> Experience of Buddha Nature is much the same as this. Your discriminating
> mind halts and you do experience something. You do have a reaction. That
> reaction varies from person to person.
>
> THIS IS THE END OF THE EXPERIENCE - what follows below is Maya (illusory).
>
> If this was the first time we have ever had this experience we might then
> think, 'What was that?', and make a judgement 'That felt good', and
> categorize the experience, 'Halting your discriminating mind is very
> desireable'. We may want to describe our experience to others, 'good',
> 'clear', 'free' and eventually give it a name: 'Mu!', or 'The Oak Tree in the
> Garden', or slapping the floor, or just turning around and walking away - or
> in my case 'Just THIS!'.
>
> On the other hand if we had heard about or read about a description of an
> experience that seemed the same as this one, and knew a name for that
> experience was 'Buddha Nature', we might just adopt that name and describe
> our experience as 'Buddha Nature', and assume it was the same as the 'Buddha
> Nature' described by others.
>
> Maybe someone who had never halted their discriminating mind or had the
> experience named 'Buddha Nature' has some kind of mystical experience. That
> person would experience much the same things as the person who halted their
> discriminating mind, and that person might beleive that this mystical
> experience was 'Buddha Nature'. Someone else hearing this account may reject
> that and say this person had not experienced 'Buddha Nature' because he did
> not halt his descriminating mind, but had an illusory mystical experience and
> declare this 'Buddha Nature' experience invalid or at least mis-identified.
>
> ****
>
> So now I'll answer your question by repeating (and modifying slightly in
> light of the explanations above) my answer I posted to a similar question
> from Siska several days ago:
>
> The most important reason and the only one that really matters is that I have
> experienced halting my discriminating mind while working on the koan Mu. Once
> you have experienced halting your discriminating mind you know that there is
> only one experience like this and there can be no mistaking it for something
> else. I beleive all experiences of halting your discriminating mind are the
> same.
>
> Secondary reasons are:
> - my experience was formally validated by two teachers (zen masters)of both
> the Renzai and Soto Japanese Zen Buddhist schools. They both used various
> names for this experience such as 'kensho' or 'satori' or 'Buddha Nature' or
> 'Buddha Mind' or 'Big Mind'.
> - my experience was informally validated by many other teachers and other zen
> practitioners
> - my experience corresponds (in my opinion) with both historical and
> modern-day
> written accounts of the same experience
>
> *****
>
> So I really can't say for sure that I experienced the same experience as
> Siddharta Buddha, or Joshu, or Koryu Roshi - but I beleive I did. And the
> important thing is not whether my experience was the same as theirs but that
> I did experience something that has changed my life and that is the
> foundation of my continuing practice. I call it 'Buddha Nature'.
>
> ...Bill!
>
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