Bill, Something zen-like may predate Buddhism. It may have been practised by people of the Indus Valley before the 'Arians' came to India. However, Sakymuni started Buddhism, followed by many modifications up to mahayana. Eventually your techer Mr Frontcorner took it up and taught you. That is what I call zen developed from Buddhism, not from Christianity or Islam. It does not contradict your statement that zen predates Buddhism and me and your good self. Still, how do you prove that something called zen existed well before the Buddha? Anthony
________________________________ From: Bill! <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Wednesday, 25 July 2012, 18:06 Subject: [Zen] Re: Chan and zen Anthony, No, zen predates Buddhism, Siddhartha Buddha and all the other Buddhas. Zen predates everything except perhaps 'sentient-ness'. So maybe the first sentient being (Adam?) could be called the first Buddha, but after that all sentient beings possessed Buddha Nature. ...Bill! --- In mailto:Zen_Forum%40yahoogroups.com, Anthony Wu <wuasg@...> wrote: > > Bill, > Â > Your 'zen' also developed from mahayana Buddhism. Otherwise, where did it > come from? If you say from Christianity, the devil and angel will both be > after you. > Â > anthony > > > ________________________________ > From: Bill! <BillSmart@...> > To: mailto:Zen_Forum%40yahoogroups.com > Sent: Monday, 23 July 2012, 9:32 > Subject: [Zen] Re: Chan and zen > > > Â > ED, > > My response below assumes by 'chan' and 'zen' you mean 'Chinese Chan > Buddhism' and 'Japanese Zen Buddhism'. Anyway, my response below is limited > to my knowledge of those... > > I only know of Chan from what I've read and the excellent information JMJM > has given us through his posts. From these I do think there is a little > difference between Chinese Chan Buddhism and Japanese Zen Buddhism, but most > of that I see are due to the different cultural wrappings of each. There are > many more parallels and similarities than differences. They are both from the > school of Mahayana Buddhism. If I were to grab any one difference to > emphasize I would say Chan Buddhism is a little more mystical than Japanese > Zen Buddhism but that's about all. > > ...Bill! > > --- In mailto:Zen_Forum%40yahoogroups.com, "ED" <seacrofter001@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Bill and JM, > > > > Do either of you perceive any substantive difference between chan and > > zen? > > > > --ED > > >
