Nobody is against revision. If you take a relook at both Jane's and My posts you'll see that clearly. The conversation was about adhering to set poetic forms, and also (in my case) the evolution of the writer/poet within. I am sure we all agree that whether you are writing free verse or a sonnet/ballad/villanelle/haiku/what have you, the poet/writer revises/edits the piece till it reaches a finished form, at least to one's own satisfaction. All self-respecting writers/artists are their own worst critics; some are more modest.
> Revision is spiritual: the lifelong search for the right word with the
> right absence. All writing is revision. So why be against it? If a
> thing could produce a variant that is its equal or better, if one
> word's reflection points to another that is truer, if, in our perverse
> poet's way, one wound could open another, why not follow the glances
> through? Or why not at least glance to see where that path could go,
> if only to come back to the original trail in time?
>
>
>
> On 1/13/06, temporal t < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > jane and rumjhum
> >
> > while it is true 'jo baat dill se nikalti hay asar rakhti hay' ...
> > (what comes from the recesses of heart is potent)...being my own
> > worst critic i have learned that only exceptional poems do not ever
> > need a rewrite
> >
> > yes, poems for me come from 'somewhere' ... but having dressed them in
> > words i usually shy away from immediate exposure...
> >
> > and
> >
> > when i look them again a week or two later i find a new perspective
> > when reading them...things i overlooked in that initial burst of
> > creativity that needs improvement
> >
> >
> > On 1/13/06, ymursawsib <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > "Technical Virtuosity". That is the term I have a bone to pick with.
> > > I am so afraid of becoming contrived in my creativity; like putting
> > > on an act, pretending. I literally used to shy away from "working"
> > > on a poem before.
> > > Like you, poetry has to 'arrive' for me too. It grows very quickly
> > > in my head and has to come out as quickly. I used to think that is
> > > the only way to write poetry until recently. I have now learned to
> > > respect the discipline of editing after the first rush of emotion.
> > > And, also to listen to reactions to the poem.(it is so easy to fall
> > > in love with my own words, not see the woods for the trees!)
> > >
> > > I have taken free verse and worked on it for rhythm and metre, but
> > > only for those poems that I believed would benefit from it.
> > > Sometimes we write down a poetic idea and think it is a poem, but it
> > > is not finished yet. Only when we return to it in the clear light of
> > > day can we see the truth; that is the time to review and consider
> > > structural changes. Once you have a strong idea it is easy to build
> > > around it. In my case this has happened to poems that I have
> > > returned to years (and in one case decades) later. I like to believe
> > > that the rhymthm and structured metre was already there in the idea,
> > > and I simply had failed to see it before.
> > >
> > > Poetry for me is a short, intense mental workout, regardless of the
> > > value of the poetic outcome. Sometimes I feel intensely about
> > > something but the poem comes out mediocre; sometimes I am able to
> > > write lucidly without involving my soul and the intensity dips down
> > > only till the level of my mind, perhaps touching my heart a bit.
> > >
> > > Whatever the worth of my own poetic efforts, I must confess that
> > > life would feel very odd without poetry; and then there is that
> > > intense pleasure of meeting a poem that nudges something deep inside
> > > you and you are elevated and enriched if only for a short span of
> > > time.
> > >
> > > Rumjhum
> > >
> > > --- In ZESTPoets@yahoogroups.com, jane bhandari <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Do you know, I don't really have an answer to your question about
> > > structured forms giving way to free verse.
> > > >
> > > > I think as children we are naturally attuned to rhyme and
> > > rhythm. Certainly rhythm. I think this stays with us all our lives,
> > > although it may become more complex and less obvious, while perhaps
> > > with time we grow out of the need for rhyme. We seldom rhyme in
> > > daily speech, but good speech has a natural rhythm.
> > > >
> > > > Looking at my own poems I see a rhythm which is close to that of
> > > speech. I have never really felt the need for rhyme except, perhaps,
> > > like Shakespeare's closing couplets - I often find that a poem has
> > > ended thus. I didn't start writing poetry till I was in my middle
> > > fifties anyway, so maybe I had simply gotten out of the habit of
> > > rhyming.
> > > >
> > > > I like poems that have a structure where it assists the poem.
> > > And I appreciate a successful poem in a difficult verse-form
> > > providing the poem works well as a poem and not just as a bit of
> > > technical virtuosity. Some poems, like the ones I just posted,
> > > simply 'arrived' and needed only a little tinkering to get them to
> > > their present form, which was nice. But I had been thinking about
> > > haiku for quite a while, so maybe it wasn't quite as accidental as
> > > it seemed.
> > > >
> > > > It's interesting to take a free verse poem and try to structure
> > > it. By using synonyms of a different syllabic length it is possible
> > > to turn an unstructured poem into one that has a definite shape.
> > > Another trick is to beat out the sound of the words and see whether
> > > you have unconsciously created a rhythm. I am willing to bet that
> > > you have.
> > > >
> > > > Anybody else want to comment?
> > > >
> > > > jane
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > You are encouraged to post poetry, respond critically to the poems circulated and participate in discussions. To post, email your message to ZESTPoets@yahoogroups.com OR post online at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ZESTPoets/post/
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > You are encouraged to post poetry, respond critically to the poems circulated and participate in discussions. To post, email your message to ZESTPoets@yahoogroups.com OR post online at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ZESTPoets/post/
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> You are encouraged to post poetry, respond critically to the poems circulated and participate in discussions. To post, email your message to ZESTPoets@yahoogroups.com OR post online at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ZESTPoets/post/
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