Re: [GNC-dev] BZ-emails; was: Bugzilla Migration Status -- phase 2

[Derek Atkins]

For what it's worth, my next reset will include all bugs and users. So this 
won't be an issue.


But I agree it's not a bug that it says it sent an email when none was sent.

-derek
Sent using my mobile device. Please excuse any typos.
On May 15, 2018 9:39:38 PM Adrien Monteleone 
 wrote:



Perhaps a bug, perhaps a feature. You’d have to check with the BZ devs.

I’ve seen some site security recommendations to NOT show a different message.

Personally, I doubt it really discourages hackers or makes their task 
harder and it just frustrates a user who isn’t sure what address he/she 
signed up with.


Regards,
Adrien

On May 15, 2018, at 3:55 PM, Frank H. Ellenberger 
 wrote:


At first, IMHO there is a bg in bugzilla:
"A token for changing your password has been emailed to
frank.h.ellenber...@gmail.com. Follow the instructions in that email to
change your password."
But there is no email. If the user is not in the database the message
should be different.
Or an email should be sent "Sorry, I don't know you..."

Creating a new account with a different address works. Email gets sent.

Am 15.05.2018 um 20:35 schrieb Derek Atkins:
:
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Re: [GNC-dev] BZ-emails; was: Bugzilla Migration Status -- phase 2

[Adrien Monteleone]

Perhaps a bug, perhaps a feature. You’d have to check with the BZ devs.

I’ve seen some site security recommendations to NOT show a different message.

Personally, I doubt it really discourages hackers or makes their task harder 
and it just frustrates a user who isn’t sure what address he/she signed up with.

Regards,
Adrien

> On May 15, 2018, at 3:55 PM, Frank H. Ellenberger 
>  wrote:
> 
> At first, IMHO there is a bg in bugzilla:
> "A token for changing your password has been emailed to
> frank.h.ellenber...@gmail.com. Follow the instructions in that email to
> change your password."
> But there is no email. If the user is not in the database the message
> should be different.
> Or an email should be sent "Sorry, I don't know you..."
> 
> Creating a new account with a different address works. Email gets sent.
> 
> Am 15.05.2018 um 20:35 schrieb Derek Atkins:
> :
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> 


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Re: [GNC-dev] BZ-emails; was: Bugzilla Migration Status -- phase 2

[Frank H. Ellenberger]

Am 15.05.2018 um 23:06 schrieb John Ralls:
> 
> 
>> On May 15, 2018, at 1:55 PM, Frank H. Ellenberger 
>>  wrote:
>>
>> At first, IMHO there is a bg in bugzilla:
>> "A token for changing your password has been emailed to
>> frank.h.ellenber...@gmail.com. Follow the instructions in that email to
>> change your password."
>> But there is no email. If the user is not in the database the message
>> should be different.
>> Or an email should be sent "Sorry, I don't know you..."
>>
>> Creating a new account with a different address works. Email gets sent.
> 
> Since frank.h.ellenber...@gmail.com doesn't seem to be in the user table yet, 
> creating a new account with that address should work. Did it not?
> 
> Regards,
> John Ralls

For first tests, I use my private address.

I was probably wrong thinking: If I am not in the user base, I will also
not be in the developer group.

So I can currently not test the real interesting views and actions.

~Frank

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[GNC-dev] L12N; was: Bugzilla Migration Status -- phase 2

[Frank H. Ellenberger]

Am 15.05.2018 um 20:35 schrieb Derek Atkins:
:

> I have not found a parameter to set this.  I wonder if this is in a
> template somewhere?  And if so, I wonder if it's different in a different
> localization.  For example, does Frank see BZ in German?  Or is it in
> English for everyone?

At gnome I have the following L12N choices:
 Language used in email:
  Site default (en)
  en
 Timezone used to display dates and times:
  Site default (Same as the server)
  
at bugzilla.gnucash.org/bugzilla/ it is the same.

Language packages are separatly shipped third-party contributions. See
Localized Versions at https://www.bugzilla.org/download/.
I am not sure, if it would make sense to install them. It might lower
the threshold. OTOH we might then get reports in all installed
languages. So I would restrict them to languages of native speakers in
the team.

~Frank
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Re: [GNC-dev] BZ-emails; was: Bugzilla Migration Status -- phase 2

[John Ralls]

> On May 15, 2018, at 1:55 PM, Frank H. Ellenberger 
>  wrote:
> 
> At first, IMHO there is a bg in bugzilla:
> "A token for changing your password has been emailed to
> frank.h.ellenber...@gmail.com. Follow the instructions in that email to
> change your password."
> But there is no email. If the user is not in the database the message
> should be different.
> Or an email should be sent "Sorry, I don't know you..."
> 
> Creating a new account with a different address works. Email gets sent.

Since frank.h.ellenber...@gmail.com doesn't seem to be in the user table yet, 
creating a new account with that address should work. Did it not?

Regards,
John Ralls


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[GNC-dev] BZ-emails; was: Bugzilla Migration Status -- phase 2

[Frank H. Ellenberger]

At first, IMHO there is a bg in bugzilla:
"A token for changing your password has been emailed to
frank.h.ellenber...@gmail.com. Follow the instructions in that email to
change your password."
But there is no email. If the user is not in the database the message
should be different.
Or an email should be sent "Sorry, I don't know you..."

Creating a new account with a different address works. Email gets sent.

Am 15.05.2018 um 20:35 schrieb Derek Atkins:
:
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Re: [GNC-dev] Bugzilla Migration Status -- phase 2 -- please test

[John Ralls]

> On May 15, 2018, at 11:35 AM, Derek Atkins  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> On Tue, May 15, 2018 1:09 pm, John Ralls wrote:
>> 
>> 
>>> On May 15, 2018, at 8:03 AM, John Ralls  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Browse is broken, searching by component returns “zarro” even if there
>>> are bugs with that category.
>> 
>> I figured out what's wrong with "browse": It creates a search that sets
>> Resolution = "---". Editing the search and removing that criterion shows
>> the component bugs.
> 
> I can probably change the default.  Looks like Gnome's default is unset,
> so I removed the "resolution=---" part of the URL and added in some
> default status settings (NEW and UNCONFIRMED for now)
> 
>> The status field is also different from Gnome's so it's not possible to
>> search for bugs in "ASSIGNED", "REOPENED", or "NEEDINFO".
> 
> Indeed.  Looks like the status categories are different.  We have:
>  NEW, UNCONFIRMED, CONFIRMED, IN_PROGRESS, RESOLVED, VERIFIED
> Gnome has:
>  UNCONFIRMED, NEW, ASSIGNED, REOPENED, NEEDINFO, RESOLVED, VERIFIED
> 
> Resolutions are also different.  WE currently have:
>  INCOMPLETE, NOTABUG, OBSOLETE, ---, FIXED, INVALID, WONTFIX, DUPLICATE,
> WORKSFORME
> Gnome has:
>  ---, FIXED, WONTFIX, DUPLICATE, NOTABUG, NOTGNOME, INCOMPLETE, INVALID,
> GNOME1.x, MOVED, OBSOLETE, NOTXIMIAN
> 
> We will have to figure out the various status and workflow settings we want.

UNCONFIRMED is turned off in 
https://bugzilla.gnome.org/editproducts.cgi?action=edit=GnuCash. I'd 
leave it that way, we don't really have time to mess with confirming new bugs. 
Otherwise I'm reasonably content with the status values in Gnome.

For resolutions I propose FIXED, WONTFIX, DUPLICATE, NOTABUG, NOTGNUCASH, 
INCOMPLETE, INVALID, and OBSOLETE for now. We might consider adding "SUPPORT" 
as in the reporter was really asking how to do something instead of reporting a 
real problem.

> 
>> Interestingly the "Browse" link in the header on Gnome is (nicely IMO)
>> customized to put up https://bugzilla.gnome.org/page.cgi?id=browse.html
>> instead of
>> https://bugzilla.gnucash.org/bugzilla/describecomponents.cgi?product=GnuCash.
> 
> I have not found a parameter to set this.  I wonder if this is in a
> template somewhere?  And if so, I wonder if it's different in a different
> localization.  For example, does Frank see BZ in German?  Or is it in
> English for everyone?
> 
>> Gnome's BZ also has a custom "My Bugs" link at the left end of the footer
>> that produces another custom page
>> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/page.cgi?id=describeuser.html. The one at the
>> right end runs a search just like the one on bugzilla.gnucash.org.
> 
> Hmm.  I do not see a My Bugs link on the footer of my Gnome BZ page
> (although I do see it on our BZ instance).  When logged in to Gnome my
> footer says:
> 
> Gnucash Bugs | My GC Bugs
> Bugs I watch with patches | Bugs I've touched in the last two weeks

You probably have them turned off in 
https://bugzilla.gnome.org/userprefs.cgi?tab=saved-searches.

Regards,
John Ralls

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Re: [GNC-dev] Bugzilla Migration Status -- phase 2 -- please test

[Adrien Monteleone]

Interesting...

From a non-developer perspective:

When logging into gnome.bugzilla.org, the very first link in the center with 
the ‘circle icons’ is “My Bugs”. As well, in my footer, the *only* thing there 
is a link “My Bugs” on the left. Both link to the URL John provided.

I watch some bugs, though I may not have touched any in two weeks, yet see 
neither of these links.

Regards,
Adrien

> On May 15, 2018, at 1:35 PM, Derek Atkins  wrote:
> 
> 
>> Gnome's BZ also has a custom "My Bugs" link at the left end of the footer
>> that produces another custom page
>> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/page.cgi?id=describeuser.html. The one at the
>> right end runs a search just like the one on bugzilla.gnucash.org.
> 
> Hmm.  I do not see a My Bugs link on the footer of my Gnome BZ page
> (although I do see it on our BZ instance).  When logged in to Gnome my
> footer says:
> 
> Gnucash Bugs | My GC Bugs
> Bugs I watch with patches | Bugs I've touched in the last two weeks
> 


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Re: [GNC-dev] Bugzilla Migration Status -- phase 2 -- please test

[Derek Atkins]

Hi,

On Tue, May 15, 2018 1:09 pm, John Ralls wrote:
>
>
>> On May 15, 2018, at 8:03 AM, John Ralls  wrote:
>>
>> Browse is broken, searching by component returns “zarro” even if there
>> are bugs with that category.
>
> I figured out what's wrong with "browse": It creates a search that sets
> Resolution = "---". Editing the search and removing that criterion shows
> the component bugs.

I can probably change the default.  Looks like Gnome's default is unset,
so I removed the "resolution=---" part of the URL and added in some
default status settings (NEW and UNCONFIRMED for now)

> The status field is also different from Gnome's so it's not possible to
> search for bugs in "ASSIGNED", "REOPENED", or "NEEDINFO".

Indeed.  Looks like the status categories are different.  We have:
  NEW, UNCONFIRMED, CONFIRMED, IN_PROGRESS, RESOLVED, VERIFIED
Gnome has:
  UNCONFIRMED, NEW, ASSIGNED, REOPENED, NEEDINFO, RESOLVED, VERIFIED

Resolutions are also different.  WE currently have:
  INCOMPLETE, NOTABUG, OBSOLETE, ---, FIXED, INVALID, WONTFIX, DUPLICATE,
WORKSFORME
Gnome has:
  ---, FIXED, WONTFIX, DUPLICATE, NOTABUG, NOTGNOME, INCOMPLETE, INVALID,
GNOME1.x, MOVED, OBSOLETE, NOTXIMIAN

We will have to figure out the various status and workflow settings we want.

> Interestingly the "Browse" link in the header on Gnome is (nicely IMO)
> customized to put up https://bugzilla.gnome.org/page.cgi?id=browse.html
> instead of
> https://bugzilla.gnucash.org/bugzilla/describecomponents.cgi?product=GnuCash.

I have not found a parameter to set this.  I wonder if this is in a
template somewhere?  And if so, I wonder if it's different in a different
localization.  For example, does Frank see BZ in German?  Or is it in
English for everyone?

> Gnome's BZ also has a custom "My Bugs" link at the left end of the footer
> that produces another custom page
> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/page.cgi?id=describeuser.html. The one at the
> right end runs a search just like the one on bugzilla.gnucash.org.

Hmm.  I do not see a My Bugs link on the footer of my Gnome BZ page
(although I do see it on our BZ instance).  When logged in to Gnome my
footer says:

Gnucash Bugs | My GC Bugs
Bugs I watch with patches | Bugs I've touched in the last two weeks

> Neither of which has anything to do with import, though the first is a bit
> of a usability problem.

True, but validating the configuration is a next step.

-derek

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Re: [GNC-dev] Bugzilla Migration Status -- phase 2 -- please test

[John Ralls]

> On May 15, 2018, at 8:03 AM, John Ralls  wrote:
> 
> Browse is broken, searching by component returns “zarro” even if there are 
> bugs with that category.

I figured out what's wrong with "browse": It creates a search that sets 
Resolution = "---". Editing the search and removing that criterion shows the 
component bugs.
The status field is also different from Gnome's so it's not possible to search 
for bugs in "ASSIGNED", "REOPENED", or "NEEDINFO".

Interestingly the "Browse" link in the header on Gnome is (nicely IMO) 
customized to put up https://bugzilla.gnome.org/page.cgi?id=browse.html instead 
of https://bugzilla.gnucash.org/bugzilla/describecomponents.cgi?product=GnuCash.
Gnome's BZ also has a custom "My Bugs" link at the left end of the footer that 
produces another custom page 
https://bugzilla.gnome.org/page.cgi?id=describeuser.html. The one at the right 
end runs a search just like the one on bugzilla.gnucash.org.

Neither of which has anything to do with import, though the first is a bit of a 
usability problem.

Regards,
John Ralls



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Re: [GNC-dev] Bugzilla Migration Status -- phase 2 -- please test

[Derek Atkins]

On Tue, May 15, 2018 11:03 am, John Ralls wrote:
>
> Browse is broken, searching by component returns “zarro” even if there are
> bugs with that category.

Are you sure?  Browse appears to be working for me.  It's just that the
default only looks for open bugs, and all the bugs are closed so they
don't show up.  If I go through the advanced search and select all
statuses then it gives me a list of bugs.

-derek

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Re: [GNC-dev] Bugzilla Migration Status -- phase 2 -- please test

[John Ralls]

> On May 15, 2018, at 8:41 AM, Derek Atkins  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> On Mon, May 14, 2018 11:10 pm, John Ralls wrote:
> 
> I think I can do that.  I suppose that means I need to look up the
> category and determine who is the pseudo-user that each category.  Should
> I add the current assignee and QA contact to the CC list if they aren't on
> it?  Or not worry about it?
> 
> Does this really matter for bugs that are closed?
> 
> Honestly I'm not completely sure how the pseudo-users work.  How does the
> email for those users get out to everyone?  Right now I think they are
> just being entered in as a "normal" user.

Derek,

No, it probably doesn't matter for closed bugs.

The pseudo-users are just fake user ids. The mail is forwarded using the "User 
Watching" feature on 
https://bugzilla.gnucash.org/bugzilla/userprefs.cgi?tab=email.

It occurs to me that as long as the pseudo-user is in the CC list and its mail 
prefs are set correctly the email watching will work and we can use the 
"assigned" value for its intended purpose. I'm not sure that the QA contact has 
an intended purpose for us.

Regards,
John Ralls

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Re: [GNC-dev] Bugzilla Migration Status -- phase 2 -- please test

[Adrien Monteleone]

Thanks for the clarification.

Regards,
Adrien

> On May 15, 2018, at 10:03 AM, John Ralls  wrote:
> 
> The bugs Derek’s imported so far are (which 3 exceptions) from 10 years ago 
> so only the users who were involved in those 103 bugs are in the system and 
> can get a password reset. That will change as he gets comfortable with the 
> imports and does larger ones. 
> 
> Browse is broken, searching by component returns “zarro” even if there are 
> bugs with that category.
> 
> Regards,
> John Ralls
> 
> 
>> On May 14, 2018, at 8:56 PM, Adrien Monteleone 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> I suppose you’re still revising things.
>> 
>> Currently, I see components listed, but no bugs found.
>> 
>> I also tried a password reset but never received the email.
>> 
>> Is this only for official developers to test right now, or anyone who has a 
>> Gnome Bugzilla account and participated in bug reports?
>> 
>> Regards,
>> Adrien
>> 
>>> On May 14, 2018, at 4:00 PM, Derek Atkins  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Everyone,
>>> 
>>> tl;dr: I have a partial migration up and running (~105 / 8588 bugs) and I
>>> think my migration script is "complete" -- please test.  Also, please let
>>> me know if you know of any bugs that use the see_also field.
>>> 
>>> Long Version:
>>> 
>>> As you all know, we use Gnome's bugzilla instance, and they are
>>> transitioning to gitlab (soon, like by June).  Since we only used Gnome
>>> infrastructure for BZ and nothing else, we decied to migrate to our own BZ
>>> instance.  Part of this migration is moving the bug data from Gnome's BZ
>>> to our own.  To that end I've been working on a script using
>>> Bugzilla::Migrate and the JSON RPC to pull the data from GnomeBZ and then
>>> migrate it into our instance.
>>> 
>>> At this point in time I *BELIEVE* I am migrating all the data we can get. 
>>> I think we're ready for the next stage of testing, which is making sure
>>> the data has been migrated correctly, nothing is missing (from the
>>> migrated data), and that the BZ instance is, effectively "configured".
>>> 
>>> To that end, please check the bugs that I've imported.  They are early in
>>> the sequence (numerically), but three out-of-sequence bugs I pulled in for
>>> dependencies and one for attachment testing from early on.   Let me know
>>> if you need some specific bug #s to search for.
>>> 
>>> One thing my data does NOT have is a bug with anytihng in the see_also
>>> data.  Does anyone know of any bugs that use that field?
>>> 
>>> A quite note on user accounts:  Users are created with crandom passwords. 
>>> If you made any comments/changes/etc to a bug then you have an account,
>>> and should be able to ask for a password reset.  I would ask that right
>>> now we make this a read-only test.  We can do write tests soon.
>>> 
>>> Also note that I will be blowing away the database regularly as we
>>> continue testing, so if you do reset your password, it will likely be
>>> resert again out from under you in the not too distant future.
>>> 
>>> Thanks for testing.  If you find any issues please let me know.  Also let
>>> me know if you have any questions.
>>> 
>>> Thanks!
>>> 
>>> -derek
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> Derek Atkins 617-623-3745
>>> de...@ihtfp.com www.ihtfp.com
>>> Computer and Internet Security Consultant
>>> 
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>> 
>> 
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Re: [GNC-dev] Bugzilla Migration Status -- phase 2 -- please test

[Derek Atkins]

John (et al),

On Tue, May 15, 2018 11:41 am, Derek Atkins wrote:
> Hi,
>
> On Mon, May 14, 2018 11:10 pm, John Ralls wrote:
>>
>> Derek,
>>
>> There are 67 GnuCash bugs in Gnome with something in the See Also field:
>>
>> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/buglist.cgi?f1=see_also_id=310012=regexp=Bug%20Number=GnuCash_format=advanced=.%2B
>> 
>>
>> The earliest one is https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=402289
>> , much later than the
>> ones you’ve imported.
>
> Ok.  I'll add 402289 to my list.

I added 402289 to the list and imported it.  However I noticed that it is
incorrectly using the See Also list.  The see-also list is supposed to
only be used to reference external bugs (according to the documentation
[0]), but in this case it's referencing an INTERNAL bug.  Specifically,
402289 is referencing https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=548357 in
its see_also field.

According to the documentation internal references should use the
depends_on or blocks entries.  Should I fix these along the way?  If I
don't then we will leave dangling references after gnome BZ goes away.  If
I do fix it, then I need some heuristic to know whether it should be a
depends_on or a blocks entry.  Or maybe it should just be fixed in gnome
BZ first?

-derek

[0] https://bugzilla.gnucash.org/bugzilla/page.cgi?id=fields.html#see_also

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Re: [GNC-dev] Bugzilla Migration Status -- phase 2 -- please test

[Derek Atkins]

Hi,

On Mon, May 14, 2018 11:10 pm, John Ralls wrote:
>
> Derek,
>
> There are 67 GnuCash bugs in Gnome with something in the See Also field:
>
> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/buglist.cgi?f1=see_also_id=310012=regexp=Bug%20Number=GnuCash_format=advanced=.%2B
> 
>
> The earliest one is https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=402289
> , much later than the
> ones you’ve imported.

Ok.  I'll add 402289 to my list.

> https://bugzilla.gnucash.org/bugzilla/buglist.cgi?j_top=OR=Bug%20Number_format=advanced
> 
> returns only 103 bugs. Are you sure you imported 105?

No, you're right.  It was only 103.  Sorry.

> If possible it would be nice to convert all of the assignees and QA
> contacts to the pseudo-users (e.g. gnucash-core-ma...@gnucash.bugs
> ) instead of the many developers
> who’re no longer working on GnuCash.

I think I can do that.  I suppose that means I need to look up the
category and determine who is the pseudo-user that each category.  Should
I add the current assignee and QA contact to the CC list if they aren't on
it?  Or not worry about it?

Does this really matter for bugs that are closed?

Honestly I'm not completely sure how the pseudo-users work.  How does the
email for those users get out to everyone?  Right now I think they are
just being entered in as a "normal" user.

> Attachments aren’t displayed in the browser even when they’re plain text,
> see https://bugzilla.gnucash.org/bugzilla/attachment.cgi?id=4=edit
> ,
> "The attachment is not viewable in your browser due to security
> restrictions enabled by your Bugzilla administrator.”

Ah, I seem to recall a config option about this.  I have adjusted this.

> I’ll poke at it some more tomorrow.

Thanks.

> Regards,
> John Ralls

-derek

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Re: [GNC-dev] Bugzilla Migration Status -- phase 2 -- please test

[John Ralls]

The bugs Derek’s imported so far are (which 3 exceptions) from 10 years ago so 
only the users who were involved in those 103 bugs are in the system and can 
get a password reset. That will change as he gets comfortable with the imports 
and does larger ones. 

Browse is broken, searching by component returns “zarro” even if there are bugs 
with that category.

Regards,
John Ralls


> On May 14, 2018, at 8:56 PM, Adrien Monteleone 
>  wrote:
> 
> I suppose you’re still revising things.
> 
> Currently, I see components listed, but no bugs found.
> 
> I also tried a password reset but never received the email.
> 
> Is this only for official developers to test right now, or anyone who has a 
> Gnome Bugzilla account and participated in bug reports?
> 
> Regards,
> Adrien
> 
>> On May 14, 2018, at 4:00 PM, Derek Atkins  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Everyone,
>> 
>> tl;dr: I have a partial migration up and running (~105 / 8588 bugs) and I
>> think my migration script is "complete" -- please test.  Also, please let
>> me know if you know of any bugs that use the see_also field.
>> 
>> Long Version:
>> 
>> As you all know, we use Gnome's bugzilla instance, and they are
>> transitioning to gitlab (soon, like by June).  Since we only used Gnome
>> infrastructure for BZ and nothing else, we decied to migrate to our own BZ
>> instance.  Part of this migration is moving the bug data from Gnome's BZ
>> to our own.  To that end I've been working on a script using
>> Bugzilla::Migrate and the JSON RPC to pull the data from GnomeBZ and then
>> migrate it into our instance.
>> 
>> At this point in time I *BELIEVE* I am migrating all the data we can get. 
>> I think we're ready for the next stage of testing, which is making sure
>> the data has been migrated correctly, nothing is missing (from the
>> migrated data), and that the BZ instance is, effectively "configured".
>> 
>> To that end, please check the bugs that I've imported.  They are early in
>> the sequence (numerically), but three out-of-sequence bugs I pulled in for
>> dependencies and one for attachment testing from early on.   Let me know
>> if you need some specific bug #s to search for.
>> 
>> One thing my data does NOT have is a bug with anytihng in the see_also
>> data.  Does anyone know of any bugs that use that field?
>> 
>> A quite note on user accounts:  Users are created with crandom passwords. 
>> If you made any comments/changes/etc to a bug then you have an account,
>> and should be able to ask for a password reset.  I would ask that right
>> now we make this a read-only test.  We can do write tests soon.
>> 
>> Also note that I will be blowing away the database regularly as we
>> continue testing, so if you do reset your password, it will likely be
>> resert again out from under you in the not too distant future.
>> 
>> Thanks for testing.  If you find any issues please let me know.  Also let
>> me know if you have any questions.
>> 
>> Thanks!
>> 
>> -derek
>> 
>> -- 
>>  Derek Atkins 617-623-3745
>>  de...@ihtfp.com www.ihtfp.com
>>  Computer and Internet Security Consultant
>> 
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> 
> 
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