Hi Everyone,
Oops. I missed two posts from Jim and did not reply to one other. I apologize
for that. Here is a correction.
On Oct 8 18:28:00 EDT Jim DeLaHunt wrote:
>I fear that Bruce McCoy pushed this thread
>astray by introducing the phrase "books…
>out of balance". This moved
And to use a concrete example:
1.4 + 1.4 = 2.8 - the sum rounds to 3.
If you round the addends, you get
1 + 1 = 2
On Fri, Oct 27, 2023 at 12:07 PM Michael or Penny Novack <
stepbystepf...@comcast.net> wrote:
> Beating what should be a dead horse.
>
> Let A, B, and C be rational numbers (ie:
Beating what should be a dead horse.
Let A, B, and C be rational numbers (ie: expressed in the form X/Y where
X and Y are integers). Let D be a function that represents the decimal
equivalent of a rational number to some finite number of decimal places.
A + B = C does NOT imply that D(A) +
Jim,
Thank you for responding. You make valid points.
On Wed, Oct 25 at 9:50 PM Jim DeLaHunt wrote and cited:
>On 2023-10-25 17:00, Bruce McCoy via gnucash-user wrote:
> We also assume that an "exactly precise" number has
the same precision as the smallest currency unit (SCU).
Bruce:
Again, I think you are holding fast to assertions which I think are
mistaken, and which lead you to misunderstanding. Let me highlight a few
in your most recent message.
On 2023-10-25 17:00, Bruce McCoy via gnucash-user wrote:
...In the following, we assume "value/price produces an
Hi Everyone,
On Sun, Oct 8 at 5:31 AM sunfish62 wrote:
>I'm not sure whose problem is being solved by
>this drawn out discussion.
>
>David T.
David, you are right. It is a drawn out discussion.
On Sat Oct 7 17:27:29 EDT 2023 Maf. King wrote:
>going around in circles.
Perhaps the broker overcharged his client.
On Sun, Oct 8, 2023 at 4:44 AM Fred Bone wrote:
> On 08 October 2023 at 4:13, David Carlson said:
>
> > Because the broker charged 15,000.00 for 1,377.41 shares?
>
> Then the effective price paid per share wasn't the stated 10.89 but
> slightly more
On 08 October 2023 at 4:13, David Carlson said:
> Because the broker charged 15,000.00 for 1,377.41 shares?
Then the effective price paid per share wasn't the stated 10.89 but
slightly more (approx 10.890003702601258884)
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FWIW, Jeff reported his problem in 2014, and was happy when Derek advised him
to enter the number of shares and the total dollar amount of the transaction,
leaving the price to be calculated. I'm not sure whose problem is being solved
by this drawn out discussion.
David T.
On Oct 8, 2023,
Because the broker charged 15,000.00 for 1,377.41 shares?
On Sun, Oct 8, 2023, 2:32 AM Fred Bone wrote:
> On 08 October 2023 at 1:06, Bruce McCoy said:
>
> [...]
>
> > What I do not yet understand is if GnuCash considers a price per share of
> > 10.89 to be a precise figure, why GnuCash does
On 08 October 2023 at 1:06, Bruce McCoy said:
[...]
> What I do not yet understand is if GnuCash considers a price per share of
> 10.89 to be a precise figure, why GnuCash does not calculate 1,377.41 *
> 10.89 = 15,000.00 for Jeff. If GnuCash doesn’t, would we consider making
> a change to
What you do not understand is that John Ralls and GnuCash recommend
entering the total amount and the total number of shares and letting
GnuCash calculate the price. THEN there is no error in the account running
balance. This is not going to change.
On Sat, Oct 7, 2023 at 8:07 PM Bruce McCoy via
Hi Maf. King,
You get the gold star of the day, for the most humerus response. You deserve it.
For mistyping “agree” and for poor proofreading, I suppose I’d get the reverse.
I deserve it.
Best Regards,
Bruce
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Hi Adrien,
I do not know what is happening with the spacing. I do not know what my e-mail
client is. And I do not know how to give you a reasonable answer – just to list
three things.
Best Regards,
Bruce
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Hi Everyone,
On Oct 7, 2023, at 12:39, Bruce McCoy via gnucash-user wrote:
>If I have missed it, please help me.
On Sat Oct 7 15:52:28 EDT 2023 John Ralls wrote:
>What you missed is my explanation that if
>user's books are out of balance it's their
>fault, not
Bruce,
On a side note, (I think John addressed your immediate concern) what in
tarnation is your e-mail client?
Not only does it oddly removing spacing between words for your own
replies, but it seems to now eat spacings between words of other
people's replies that you QUOTE!!!
Really,
Hi Everyone,
On Sat Oct 7 15:48:25 EDT 2023 John Ralls wrote:
>GnuCash does **NOT** round prices to two decimals.
>Prices are always calculated to the full numeric
>precision of 1/2^64. Amounts and values are what
>get rounded to the respective
On Saturday, 7 October 2023 20:03:31 BST Bruce McCoy via gnucash-user wrote:
> Again,we age.
Yes, we do.
Too quickly to be going around in circles.
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> On Oct 7, 2023, at 09:54, Bruce McCoy via gnucash-user
> wrote:
> The books are out of balance when either the “Computing cost of goods sold”
> calculations or the “Average Cost price source” differ from the “the trial
> balance report” calculations. Both of these are more major points. Is
> On Oct 7, 2023, at 12:39, Bruce McCoy via gnucash-user
> wrote:
>
>
> IfI have missed it, please help me. I do not remember getting an answerto the
> question “What are the plans to help our users whose booksare out of balance
> by a cent or so?”
What you missed is my explanation that
GnuCash does **NOT** round prices to two decimals. Prices are always calculated
to the full numeric precision of 1/2^64. Amounts and values are what get
rounded to the respective commodity/currency's smallest unit. Since 15000 and
137741 have no common factors GnuCash will represent that as
Hi Everyone,
OnSat, Oct 7 at 1:25 PM David Carlson wrote:
>Howmany times must you bring up the same
>non-point?
Youare right in that I am addressing a community of people who areinterested in
and actively developing GnuCash. As a community, youuse GnuCash and tolerate
some of its
Hi Everyone,
David,thank you for responding. I appreciate your input.
OnSat, Oct 7 at 1:25 PM David Carlson wrote:
>Accordingto my HP handheld calculator,
>15,000.00divided by 1,377.41 yields 10.8900.
>Accordingto my hp 49g+ scientific graphing
>calculator,15,000.00 divided
On 2023-10-07 09:54, Bruce McCoy via gnucash-user wrote:
> Our question for discussion is as follows:
>
> >What are the plans to help our users whose
> >books are out of balance by a cent or so?
In the name of heaven, will you never let it go? How many times must you
bring up
According to my HP handheld calculator, 15,000.00 divided by 1,377.41
yields 10.8900. According to my hp 49g+ scientific graphing calculator,
15,000.00 divided by 1,377.41 yields 10.8900037026. I defy anyone to pay
that amount per share in U.S. currency. I am sure the broker's report
showed
Hi Everyone,
On Fri, Oct 6 at 1:02 PM John Ralls wrote:
>Book out of balance, meaning that the trial balance
>report doesn't balance with the Average Cost price
>source, nearly always results from not computing
>capital gains/losses correctly. Interpret that
> On Oct 6, 2023, at 9:39 AM, Bruce McCoy via gnucash-user
> wrote:
>
> Hi Everyone,
> On Tue, Sep 26 at 12:50 PM John Ralls wrote:>GnuCash uses a pair of
> stack-allocated 128-bit integers (see. . .
>
> Thanks. Well done.
>
>
> What are the plans to help our users whose books
Hi Everyone,
On Tue, Sep 26 at 12:50 PM John Ralls wrote: >GnuCash uses a pair of
stack-allocated 128-bit integers (see. . .
Thanks. Well done.
What are the plans to help our users whose books are out of balance by a cent
or so?
Best Regards,
Bruce
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Hi,
On9/25/2023 9:50 PM, Adrien Monteleone wrote:
>you likely can't send zip files through this >mailman instance.
OK.I wondered about that. Thanks.
>postthem on a hosting site and simply >paste the links in
another reply.
On Tue, Sep 26, 2023 at 11:50 john wrote
…
Thanks, John—nice work!
-Tom
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> On Sep 26, 2023, at 08:31, Tom Browder wrote:
>
> On Mon, Sep 25, 2023 at 20:07 Bruce McCoy via gnucash-user <
> gnucash-user@gnucash.org> wrote:
> ...discussion of GnuCash's handling of numbers...
>
> Does GnuCash use the Gnu Multiple Precision Arithmetic (GMP) library?
No. Like all
On Mon, Sep 25, 2023 at 20:07 Bruce McCoy via gnucash-user <
gnucash-user@gnucash.org> wrote:
...discussion of GnuCash's handling of numbers...
Does GnuCash use the Gnu Multiple Precision Arithmetic (GMP) library?
-Tom
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On 9/25/2023 9:50 PM, Adrien Monteleone wrote:
It still did not come through as you likely can't send zip files
through this mailman instance.
What exactly are you sending, just images? Attach them individually,
or else post them on a hosting site and simply paste the links in
another reply.
It still did not come through as you likely can't send zip files through
this mailman instance.
What exactly are you sending, just images? Attach them individually, or
else post them on a hosting site and simply paste the links in another
reply.
---
And it seems at least in this last
Hi everybody,
Since this is a relatively long post, there are summaries at each end. The
first section runs through "Old Business." The second section starts with "New
Business."
The third section is just the attachment. To see the illustrations, please
unzip the attachment,if present.
Hieverybody,
Sincethis is a relatively long post, there are summaries at each end. Thefirst
section runs through "Old Business." The secondsection starts with "New
Business." The third section isjust the attachment. To see the illustrations,
please unzip theattachment,if present.
Hieverybody,
Congratulationson releasing GnuCash 5.4. You are doing excellent work. Thank
you somuch.
Sincethis is a relatively long post, there are summaries at each end. Thefirst
section runs through "Old Business." The secondsection starts with "New
Business." The third section
Bruce:
On 2023-09-14 14:51, Bruce McCoy via gnucash-user wrote:
...Whatare some of the options available to GnuCash programmers today toimprove
precision? Here is one group
[Long list of arithmetic libraries elided]
Wait, you skipped a step. You have still not demonstrated that the
Jim,
Whatare some of the options available to GnuCash programmers today toimprove
precision? Here is one group.
Decimal-FloatingArithmetic
GeneralDecimal Arithmetic
http://speleotrove.com/decimal
http://speleotrove.com/decimal/#decNumber
http://speleotrove.com/decimal/#links
Hello again, Bruce!
I can point out a logic error in your argument here.
On 2023-09-13 17:28, Bruce McCoy via gnucash-user wrote:
...Yousay that 3750/599 is "the more accurate." How precise isit? Let's see.
2.396shares * (3750/599) $/share = 2.396 shares
Jim,
Inyour response of Mon, Aug 21, 2023 at 5:00 PM via GnuCash-user yousaid:
"Logically,$value = $price/share * #shares, and this should be
preciseequality."
GnuCash“stores the price as a rational number, a ratio between numeratorand
denominator,”
"price= 15000/2396 =
Hello, Bruce:
I would like to reply to a few places in your detailed message where I
think I can clarify the argument.
On 2023-09-09 10:59, Bruce McCoy via gnucash-user wrote:
"he actual $value of this $price and #shares is $14.99896, a difference of
$0.00104."
At the moment,
On 2023-09-09 12:19, Ken Farley wrote:
> I really don't see what is so difficult to understand about this.
>
> The key equation is AMOUNT = PRICE * SHARES
>
> Gnucash works under the philosophy that two of those terms must be
> maintained precisely:
>
> AMOUNT - the total cost of the
Bruce,
I don't know who this "Jim" is, their replies are not making it to the list.
Unfortunately their understanding of GnuCash's handling of amount, value, and
price is flawed.
Amount is the quantity of a split in the split account's commodity.
Value is that amount converted to the
I really don't see what is so difficult to understand about this.
The key equation is AMOUNT = PRICE * SHARES
Gnucash works under the philosophy that two of those terms must be
maintained precisely:
AMOUNT - the total cost of the transaction. What you ultimately paid in
the currency of your
Jim,
Thank you for your response of Mon, Aug 21, 2023 at 5:00 PM via GnuCash-user.
In it you said:
"Logically, $value = $price/share * #shares, and this should be precise
equality."
This is certainly true. And accuracy is a top consideration in a financial
program.
Jim,
Whata pleasure to read your response. What a pause before my response.
Youare kind enough to say:
Iam interested by your statement, "results in gnucash reducingthe shares
in the fund by 2.4". GnuCash is capable of storingshare counts to three
decimal places. However, a
Bruce:
Welcome to the gnucash-user email list! Hopefully we can give you some
useful answers. I will answer based on what I have heard developers say
on the list, and what I see in my stock transactions in GnuCash, though
I have not read the relevant GnuCash source code.
On 2023-08-21
Bruce, please include the user list in your replies. Then others are kept in
the loop. I am copying your reply here this time.
Also, I am at my computer with a real keyboard so I will hopefully avoid fat
finger mistakes. Your rhetorical questions do not have good answers.
Historically,
The developers can give you a more detailed answer, but in fact GnuCash
carries much more prrcision inyernally. To get the best results, enter
number of shares and total currency then let GnuCash calculate the price.
That usually allows GnuCash reports
To mstch your brokers reports.
On Mon,
Greetings to all of you,
Ingnucash, you have developed a wonderful program. Thank you.
Greatis my anticipation for using it, although there is at least one areaI do
not understand. Could you please help me comprehend what ishappening in the
calculations of gnucash compared with
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