RE: [ActiveDir] GPO and the Outlook Dumpster

Roger Seielstad Thu, 15 Jan 2004 12:19:42 -0800

Title: Message

There is an option in ExMerge to specifically select items in the Dumpster.

--------------------------------------------------------------
Roger D. Seielstad - MTS MCSE MS-MVP
Sr. Systems Administrator
Inovis Inc.

-----Original Message-----
From: Ayers, Diane [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2004 12:30 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] GPO and the Outlook Dumpster

Following this thread, a related question (taking it even more OT) comes up. Often in email discovery cases, we use ExMerge to suck the dumpster off a server to look at what's there. Would DumpsterAlwaysOn on the host that ExMerge is run from have an effect on what data is recovered from the Dumpster?

Diane

From: Mulnick, Al [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2004 8:57 AM
To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] GPO and the Outlook Dumpster

I get different results. Feeling inaccurate, I went and enabled dumpsteralwayson on my computer. Shift+Delete the message. Check the folder it was deleted from and voila (that's my extent of French) it was in the deleted items recovery. Not too happy about that, I removed the setting, and this time went to an IMAP client. DumpsterAlwaysOn was not set at this point. I deleted and purged a message. Closed the IMAP client, and opened Outlook (XP) after resetting the key to 1. Check that folder with deleted items recovery and the message was there to be recovered. Try Shift+Delete on another message, and then was able to recover it.

Bottom line, Roger and Olly are right. The message doesn't go away regardless of client or hard delete. It's marked for deletion and is later purged. You have to go into the deleted item recovery and purge the message to make it gone from all but a backup of the mailstore.

One note: I didn't need the registry setting to enable the use of recovery on the deleted items folder. That was there by default. I need the registry setting to see the form for other folders however.

Thanks for clearing that up :)
-----Original Message-----
From: deji Agba [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2004 11:09 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] GPO and the Outlook Dumpster

That is exactly how it operates in the field. UNLESS you have manually enabled DumpsterAlwaysOn on a client, when a client SHIFT-DELETES a piece of mail, that mail is GONE and NOT recoverable without going through an interesting hoop. That hoop involves looking for the most recent backup of the user's Mailbox Server's Information Store. This is what my initial response to Oliver said Now, I'm done.

Sincerely,

Dèjì Akómöláfé, MCSE MCSA MCP+I
www.akomolafe.com
www.iyaburo.com
Do you now realize that Today is the Tomorrow you were worried about Yesterday? -anon

From: Oliver Marshall
Sent: Thu 1/15/2004 7:16 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] GPO and the Outlook Dumpster
Thanks for the interesting comments on this thread. I have had official word from several MS support peeps that would seem to resolve the issue. It would seem that SHIFT+DELETE marks a message as deleted immediately without it being moved to the delted items first. As the message is only MARKED as deleted but not actually deleted it is simply not visible to the user but does still remain in the datastore. If items are sent to the deleted items they are simply moved to the deleted items. Emptying the deleted items marks all the items in that folder as deleted.

So SHIFT+DELETE doesn't permanently delete emails, just permanently hides them from the user. The DUMPSTERON reg trick simply makes the dumpster menu item visible on all folders rather than just the deleted items folder.

Hope that helps.

Olly 

-----Original Message-----
From: deji Agba [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 15 January 2004 07:18
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] GPO and the Outlook Dumpster

I usually refrain from adding to a thread more than once, except to occasionally concur. I have always thought that, all things being equal, Shift-Delete is indeed a permanent delete, given the following circumstances:
 
>> Assuming you DON'T have deleted item retention enabled - which is the 
>>default configuration  You have not enabled DumpsterAlwaysOn -which is 
>>the default configuration You don't do brick-level backup, you don't 
>>have an offline Exchange server you test restore to, AND you are not 
>>willing to interrupt other users' access to do a live restore
 
I've been known to be wrong before, but I don't think this is one of those moments :-p
 
Sincerely,

Dèjì Akómöláfé, MCSE MCSA MCP+I
www.akomolafe.com
www.iyaburo.com
Do you now realize that Today is the Tomorrow you were worried about Yesterday?  -anon

________________________________

From: Roger Seielstad
Sent: Wed 1/14/2004 4:58 AM
To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] GPO and the Outlook Dumpster


But Shift-Delete is not a permanent delete. Assuming you have deleted item retension enabled, shift-delete simply marks the message for deletion, but it is still available within that folder's dumpster until the DIR time expires, and is accessible using the DumpsterAlwaysOn registry setting for Outlook.
 
Scared the crap out of my desktop guy who thought he could hide email...
 
Roger
--------------------------------------------------------------
Roger D. Seielstad - MTS MCSE MS-MVP
Sr. Systems Administrator
Inovis Inc. 

	-----Original Message-----
	From: deji Agba [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
	Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 1:40 AM
	To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
	Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] GPO and the Outlook Dumpster
	
	
	your protection against this "CYA" type of deletion is backup. If you maintain a diligent backup of your Exchange Server, you can always do a restore to your offline server whenever you need to "prove" something. Disabling access to the "Recover Deleted Items" folder will not buy you much with a determined user who wants to cover his/her track. Shift-Del will not send deleted items to that folder, you know?
	 
	
	 
	Sincerely,
	
	Dèjì Akómöláfé, MCSE MCSA MCP+I
	www.akomolafe.com
	www.iyaburo.com
	Do you now realize that Today is the Tomorrow you were worried about Yesterday?  -anon

________________________________

	From: Oliver Marshall
	Sent: Tue 1/13/2004 12:07 PM
	To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
	Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] GPO and the Outlook Dumpster
	
	
	Because while the Recover Deleted Items addin allows you...err...recover
	deleted items a user can also delete things permanently. We have had
	people 'covering their tracks' by deleting emails.
	
	I don't want to disable the feature all together as it's a useful IT
	tool for managers etc, but not for users.
	
	Olly 
	
	-----Original Message-----
	From: David, Andy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
	Sent: 13 January 2004 19:15
	To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
	Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] GPO and the Outlook Dumpster
	
	I'm just wondering why you would want to implement such a thing. 
	 
	
	-----Original Message-----
	From: Roger Seielstad [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
	Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2004 12:27 PM
	To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'
	Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] GPO and the Outlook Dumpster
	
	It strikes me that it might be part of the Office Administration
	Templates, which can be distributed via GPOs, but aren't actually part
	of the GPO settings.
	
	http://www.microsoft.com/office/ork/2003/five/ch18/MntA04.htm
	
	There are similar templates for Office XP and Office 2000 that might do
	the trick.
	
	Roger
	--------------------------------------------------------------
	Roger D. Seielstad - MTS MCSE MS-MVP
	Sr. Systems Administrator
	Inovis Inc.
	
	
	> -----Original Message-----
	> From: Oliver Marshall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
	> Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2004 11:19 AM
	> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
	> Subject: [ActiveDir] GPO and the Outlook Dumpster
	> 
	> 
	> Does anyone know a GPO setting that will allow me to prevent users 
	> from accessing the Recover Deleted Items addin in Outlook ? Someone on
	
	> an exchange mailing list said that there is a GP setting to prevent 
	> this addin being loaded.
	> 
	> Olly
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RE: [ActiveDir] GPO and the Outlook Dumpster

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