Hey Jorge,
thanks for your thoughts - you missed that I'm not going to
register the AD DCs in WINS, so that's not an issue. It's having them in the
same subnet is what I'm slightly worried about and need to check if it's even
possible.
Messing with the old domain name is not an option either
(don't forget it's production until fully migrated...). And not much time to do
it either...
The interimdomain scenario was another one going through my
head (yes - indeed similar to my DEC session ;-) - but I'm trying to avoid it
here as I know what's involved... And it bugs me that they "just"
have the same names - MS definitely needs to come up with something like
"domain-name aliases" (and I think they're even working on this). But
I'll definitely leave the interimdomain/forest option on my list if I get the
deal (still bid phase). And definitely a good topic for next DEC (just
kidding - I'd say migrations are getting somewhat boring... - however, not one
is the same as another...)
Cheers,
Guido From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jorge de Almeida Pinto Sent: Donnerstag, 16. Juni 2005 16:08 To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Migration between domains with same NetBios name Hi Guido,
NetBIOS based domains/clients
find domain controllers through the WINS record 1Ch. If two different domains
share the same WINS infrastructure I think both domain's DCs wil register in the
same record and then you will have some interesting troubleshooting to do. Don't
forget that most migration tools use the browser service to enumerate several
objects.. again tricky.
As allready said renaming the
source domain is a possibility (however I'm not sure if E55 likes domain
renames). For this you need to inventory all places that use THE NAME OLDOMAIN
in user accounts. One of the examples are the logon account for services. I'm
sure there more. To do this you are stuck to a "major step
moment"
Another possibility is to use an
interim domain which I think gives you the possibility to do a phase migration.
You will me migrating twice though.
MIGRATION
SCENARIO:
* OLDDOMAIN -> INTERIMDOMAIN
| NEWDOMAIN
* OLDDOMAIN | INTERIMDOMAIN
-> NEWDOMAIN
INTERIMDOMAIN migration - quick
and dirty steps
* Pre-install and configure
(isolated) NEWDOMAIN, its DNS, its DHCP, its WINS, etc. and shutdown
afterwards
* 2 DCs (W2K3 AD) for
interim
* Exch55. in the same org as
exch. in OLDOMAIN
* Migrate servers, clients,
users, groups, mailboxes,etc. from OLDDOMAIN to
INTERIMDOMAIN
* Configure INTERIMDOMAIN
SERVERS to use WINS infrastructure from OLDDOMAIN
*
Configure INTERIMDOMAIN CLIENTS to use DHCP infrastructure from
OLDDOMAIN
*
Decommission old exchange in OLDOMAIN
* Shutdown old
domain
* Bring up
NEWDOMAIN
* Reconfigure servers and
clients to use WINS and DHCP from NEWDOMAIN
* Install exch2k3 in
NEWDOMAIN
*
Migrate servers, clients, users, groups, mailboxes,etc. from INTERIMDOMAIN
to NEWDOMAIN
etc.etc.
What do you think abou this
one?
Cheers
#JORGE#
I think almost the same scenario
as the situation you presented during DEC "Handling_Mergers_and_Acquistions".
Let me guess your next presentation at DEC will be "Migrations between
domains with the same NetBIOS name"? ;-))
Whatever scenario you choose
will be painfull. You must however think about the scenarion to use that is less
painfull From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Grillenmeier, Guido Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2005 09:53 To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Migration between domains with same NetBios name Thanks Eric, renaming the source NT4 domain was on the list
of my options and I know that it works as I've done it before in a larger
test-environment. However, I expect many more headaches in a production
environment as it's difficult to analyse all the dependencies to existing apps,
e.g. Exchange 5.5 and others.
And since you need to re-join all members to the domain
anyways, it's almost as much work as just joining them to the target
domain...
...hmm - that just triggered a thought - I guess it would
be possible to do just that: rename the source dom (on PDC) + re-join all BDCs,
then setup trust to the target domain and join all resources to target domain
while accounts & groups are still in (renamed) source domain. [thinking
continues]... ofcourse the challenges with the apps and potential dependencies
on the old domain name remain and need to be analysed first - so it's really
tough to estimate the amount of work involved for this...
Besides, the obvious downside is fallback options =>
customers usually don't allow any drastic changes in the existing
infrastructure, when migrating to another one - which I fully
understand.
So I was
mainly seeking for other experience and things to look out for, if domain rename
is not an option. E.g. is it really an issue to have a BDC of the NT4 CORP
domain in the same subnet as a DC of the AD CORP domain? I guess I could
hinder the AD DC somehow from trying to race against the NT4 BDC to
become master browser. Even when we plan to do a hard-cutover (long
weekend), I'll need DCs of both domains available at some point... And I
know I need to test this anyways, but can't do so right
now.
I should mention, that I'm talking about roughly 1000
users with clients and servers distributed in a dozen locations. So nothing
major - a hard cutover should be doable over a long 4-day weekend (incl.
migration of all mailboxes at once) and handling re-ACLing on the FS is no
issue.
Accrd. to customer, there are no other apps (other than
Exchange) that leverage the NT4 domain for anything (other than running on a
memberserver). My past experience tells me that this is likely not to be
true... I'm sure there are other things that are often overlooked - any
ideas?
/Guido
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Eric Fleischman Sent: Donnerstag, 16. Juni 2005 07:53 To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Migration between domains with same NetBios name Rename
it? I will admit, I’ve
never actually tried this, but I know people who say it works. I think you
should try this procedure, on a test box first, and report back. Maybe you
should do it to an BDC you bring up just to test, isolated, and see how it
goes. http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;169741 If this does work, I’d
like to know, so I can recommend it in the future. The other option is
logical data migration but not actual “migration” if you will. IE, ldifde and
such. But that comes with the normal “lose the SIDs” type of issues, which I
assume to be a major headache for your scenario. ~Eric PS: Basically, this
mail translates roughly in to me saying, this might or might not work, and I’d
like you to be my testing guy to let me know, since I’ve never had occasion to
give it a whirl myself. From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of Grillenmeier,
Guido Here is a nice one - I've done
quite a few migration with all kinds of scenarios, so I hardly ask questions
around this topic. But when migrating from one NT4
domain to an AD domain which both have the same NetBios names,
various issues and potential conflicts come to mind and I wonder if others had
to do this in the past, who could share their
experience. Think about an existing NT4 domain
called CORP and another existing AD domain called CORP
(with DNS=copr.company.com). And now you need to migrate all users and
resources from the NT4 CORP to the AD CORP and place AD DCs into the same sites
as the exising NT4 DCs... I can imagine various challenges,
besides not being able to setup a trust and thus loosing various options for
doing a "normal" migration. At least I have no need to register the AD
domain in WINS; all clients are XP, but I know for sure that I'm going to
run into various other issues (the worst one being that the account activation
and the resource migration has to happend instantaneously, since resource access
won't be possible accross the domains). But I'm also thinking of networking
issues with and NT4 DC of the one and an AD DC of the other domain in the same
ip-subnet... I wonder how others have tackled
this challenge and what issues you ran into. /Guido This e-mail and any attachment is for authorised use by the intended recipient(s) only. It may contain proprietary material, confidential information and/or be subject to legal privilege. It should not be copied, disclosed to, retained or used by, any other party. If you are not an intended recipient then please promptly delete this e-mail and any attachment and all copies and inform the sender. Thank you. |
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