Mr. Raibeck, I appreciate your feedback and, being involved in IT for some 30 years, I understand the technical challenges involved. That is why I posted the question. With the falling cost of disk architecture, a disk to disk backup alternative seems to be coming close to rivaling disk to tape as a backup alternative. Especially when dealing with some of the more sophisticated tape solutions that involve the mainframe/zArchitecture. If I size my TSM solution such that I can recover 'x' number of application servers in a given number of hours, then I will require a certain number of tape drives based on the data transfer rate of each tape drive. Hence, any recovery process in DR mode is limited to the number of tape drives available. Ouch!!! With disk to disk, my limitation is the TSM server and the network. Add to the mix the fact that tape data transfer speeds are less than SCSI and/or ATA data transfer speeds and the thought is that with capacity of disk architectures increasing rapidly and the price currently lower than tape, it makes sense to back up everything to disk!!! Faster and lower cost! So, I/we would appreciate IBM Tivoli's support of this concept. With all the pressure on budgets and all these jobs NAFTAing, I MUST arrive at the best solution! Thanks for your consideration.
John G. Talafous IS Technical Principal The Timken Company Global Software Support P.O. Box 6927 Data Management 1835 Dueber Ave. S.W. Phone: (330)-471-3390 Canton, Ohio USA 44706-0927 Fax : (330)-471-4034 [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.timken.com -----Original Message----- From: Andrew Raibeck [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, June 09, 2003 1:33 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: anyone using ATA disk systems Addendum: I as I said earlier, we continue to study the matter. Possible outcomes include enhancements that will enable TSM to function better in an all disk storage pool environment, although we make no commitments at this time. Regards, Andy Andy Raibeck IBM Software Group Tivoli Storage Manager Client Development Internal Notes e-mail: Andrew Raibeck/Tucson/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Internet e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] The only dumb question is the one that goes unasked. The command line is your friend. "Good enough" is the enemy of excellence. Andrew Raibeck/Tucson/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent by: "ADSM: Dist Stor Manager" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 06/09/2003 10:25 Please respond to "ADSM: Dist Stor Manager" To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] cc: Subject: Re: anyone using ATA disk systems We have not done a lot of testing on this, so this can not be taken as a definitive statement. With that said, the following sums up our current thoughts on this: - Because there is no reclamation for random access storage pools, (a) disk fragmentation is definitely a concern, and (b) aggregates are not rebuilt, so as objects within an aggregate expire, that space is not freed up until all objects in the aggregate have expired. This can cause inefficient utilization of the disk space over time. - FILE device classes could be used, but represent configuration and performance concerns. - While such an environment is technically possible, it is not the intended TSM usage model, and we do not recommend it at this time. - We continue to study this issue. Regards, Andy Andy Raibeck IBM Software Group Tivoli Storage Manager Client Development Internal Notes e-mail: Andrew Raibeck/Tucson/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Internet e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] The only dumb question is the one that goes unasked. The command line is your friend. "Good enough" is the enemy of excellence. Steve Schaub <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent by: "ADSM: Dist Stor Manager" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 05/23/2003 07:08 Please respond to "ADSM: Dist Stor Manager" To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] cc: Subject: Re: anyone using ATA disk systems Hey Andy R, how about getting some Tivoli developers on the server-side to throw some answers at this. I have spoken with many users, business partners, & architects and have yet to get a consistant picture. Some insist that using one huge diskpool works fine, others say the disk format leads to disastrous fragmentation and the only way to go is file class volumes, still others say not to even try this approach. Maybe a Tivoli white paper specifically addressing disk-only primary storage pools would give a definitive answer? -----Original Message----- From: Talafous, John G. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, May 23, 2003 9:26 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: anyone using ATA disk systems We too are considering a mass expansion of our storage pools to implement Disk to Disk backup via TSM. The reason is to enhance recovery times. The Nexsan ATABeast is under consideration. We currently have about 40TB backed up to TSM storage pools. I am thinking of bringing in MANY TB of ATABeast so that we can discontinue migration to tape. I am curious as to what happens internally in TSM when you drive your storage pool utilization to, say, 80% and hold it there? Are there any performance penalties? Any cautions? Any real world experience? How much ATA should I consider? TIA, John G. Talafous IS Technical Principal The Timken Company Global Software Support P.O. Box 6927 Data Management 1835 Dueber Ave. S.W. Phone: (330)-471-3390 Canton, Ohio USA 44706-0927 Fax : (330)-471-4034 [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.timken.com ********************************************************************** This message and any attachments are intended for the individual or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, please do not forward, copy, print, use or disclose this communication to others; also please notify the sender by replying to this message, and then delete it from your system. The Timken Company **********************************************************************