Yeah, propay has had it for a while I know. I was just curious about what Lewis was using. That was a few years back.
On Fri, Jun 29, 2018 at 9:25 AM, Adair Winter <ada...@amarillowireless.net> wrote: > Propay and powercode does auto ach bounce back > > On Fri, Jun 29, 2018 at 9:23 AM Cameron Crum <cc...@murcevilo.com> wrote: > >> I'm curious how your software knew of the bounced ach? I know with IPPay >> they didn't have a way to report this back to the software until fairly >> recently. What processor were you using? Or was it just someone checking >> every day as part of their job? >> >> Cameron >> >> On Fri, Jun 29, 2018 at 8:52 AM, Larry Smith <lesm...@ecsis.net> wrote: >> >>> > Checks are a very outdated method for payment >>> >>> May be, but under US Law (Uniform Commercial Code) >>> a check is a "promisary note" and as such a contract to pay. >>> You can easily take someone to court over a bounced or bad >>> check. >>> >>> -- >>> Larry Smith >>> lesm...@ecsis.net >>> >>> On Fri June 29 2018 08:43, Matt Hoppes wrote: >>> > Oh yes, we have people complain all the time that they went to the >>> bank and >>> > sent a check out but we never got it for another two weeks or so. >>> > >>> > We also have people who say that their checks got lost in the mail or >>> we >>> > get an envelope that was never sealed. >>> > >>> > Yet another reason why I tell people that the credit card payment >>> method is >>> > much more secure than checks. >>> > >>> > Checks are a very outdated method for payment >>> > >>> > > On Jun 29, 2018, at 09:38, Lewis Bergman <lewis.berg...@gmail.com> >>> wrote: >>> > > >>> > > My cost of doing business was lower, which is why I did it. Maybe >>> yours >>> > > isn't. I will say it was a management push on my part to enforce >>> policies >>> > > that got everyone on ACH if possible. ACH was free, CC wasn't. As a >>> > > result, maybe we had a more general cross section of our customer >>> base on >>> > > ACH that you so we didn't huge differences. And I guess that's why >>> people >>> > > do it differently. Your experience wasn't mine. But if mine was 5 >>> times >>> > > worse I would still find it compelling from a monetary viewpoint. >>> But, it >>> > > really wasn't an issue for us from the PITA point of view because the >>> > > software handled most of it. Maybe your customer base was >>> significantly >>> > > different than mine. We also got a big kick in ACH enrollment >>> because a >>> > > bunch of the banks in our area used the same "Bill Pay" check >>> printing >>> > > service. As we got one envelope with 150 checks in it for different >>> > > accounts, all listing something stupid like ISP as the account >>> number, >>> > > and on top of that, payment was made late. The inevitable calls came >>> in >>> > > about why they were charged late fees, they scheduled it payed a week >>> > > ahead of deadlines, etc. We would have to explain that we could show >>> them >>> > > the postmark, the date on the check, etc. Customer would say "they >>> took >>> > > the money out of my account on ...". Our pitch was always that if >>> they >>> > > let us pull the money via ACH we wouldn't charge them and they could >>> > > never be assessed a late fee if we did the ACH. That got a bunch. But >>> > > again, our experiences seem to be quite different. >>> > > >>> > > I just put the possibility of contested CC out there. I don't think >>> we >>> > > ever had anyone contest a charge. Maybe once on an install. I don't >>> > > remember it if we did. But in my experience, that possibility was >>> roughly >>> > > the same as my chances of losing more money doing ACH than CC. >>> > > >>> > > In the end, that is what's great about this place right? I don't >>> have to >>> > > do it like you and vice versa. >>> > > >>> > >> On Fri, Jun 29, 2018 at 8:06 AM Matt Hoppes >>> > >> <mattli...@rivervalleyinternet.net> wrote: It’s just the cost of >>> doing >>> > >> business. >>> > >> >>> > >> And yes they do have 60 days to contest it but most people don’t. >>> > >> >>> > >> We have a small handful of ACH and the number of bounced >>> transactions >>> > >> that occurred there is much much much higher than anyone contesting >>> a >>> > >> credit card transactions. >>> > >> >>> > >>> On Jun 29, 2018, at 08:21, Lewis Bergman <lewis.berg...@gmail.com> >>> > >>> wrote: >>> > >>> >>> > >>> If you can't figure it out maybe math is the issue. 25 cents for >>> ACH. >>> > >>> CC is 2.75% and up. If you are doing 400k a month in CC that adds >>> up to >>> > >>> about 10k more in fees. In all the time we did ACH we probably >>> lost an >>> > >>> additional 3k that we would not have lost with CC. So.... 3k in 10 >>> > >>> years is less than 10k in one month. >>> > >>> >>> > >>> So why do people still do it...they can do simple arithmetic? >>> > >>> >>> > >>> You do raise some valid points. If you have to have the money and >>> can't >>> > >>> wait two days and so want to pay an effective annual interest rate >>> that >>> > >>> is enormous. >>> > >>> >>> > >>> If you are drafting the routing and account info is your customers >>> not >>> > >>> yours. >>> > >>> >>> > >>> I had someone fraudulently present a check for 92k on my account. >>> Maybe >>> > >>> that proves your point, but the bank credited my account in a >>> couple of >>> > >>> weeks and it really wasn't a big deal to get done. Only time it has >>> > >>> ever happened. So again, the math tells me even if that happened >>> every >>> > >>> year one time instead of once in twenty years, and I didn't get my >>> > >>> money back, I would still be better off using ACH. >>> > >>> >>> > >>> But, to each his own. I know a lot of people don't like the 2 day >>> > >>> settlement period for ACH. in truth, CC is longer. You have >>> what... 60 >>> > >>> days for someone to contest a charge. While they do it the bank >>> takes >>> > >>> the money back. Not that that is a big risk. Probably about the >>> same as >>> > >>> someone's ACH not clearing. >>> > >>> >>> > >>>> On Thu, Jun 28, 2018, 9:39 PM Matt Hoppes >>> > >>>> <mattli...@rivervalleyinternet.net> wrote: ACH is slow (2 days to >>> > >>>> clear) >>> > >>>> ACH is insecure (bank account numbers can be gotten off checks, >>> etc) >>> > >>>> ACH can wipe you out (if someone gets those account numbers) >>> > >>>> ACH does not provide real-time-feedback (may not know things >>> didn’t >>> > >>>> work until it bounces two days later) >>> > >>>> >>> > >>>> Why anyone still uses ACH or checks or beyond me. >>> > >>>> >>> > >>>> A credit card is: >>> > >>>> Instant (funds transfer immediately, you instantly know if the >>> funds >>> > >>>> are coming or not) >>> > >>>> >>> > >>>> Secure (there is a CVV code required - just having the number >>> gets you >>> > >>>> nowhere) >>> > >>>> >>> > >>>> Safe (if someone does steal your card they won’t wipe out your >>> account >>> > >>>> and you can quickly get the funds/transactions reversed) >>> > >>>> >>> > >>>> Easy to dispute >>> > >>>> >>> > >>>> >>> > >>>> I have one vendor I pay via check every month because they won’t >>> take >>> > >>>> cards. Otherwise everything I pay personally and business is on >>> CC. >>> > >>>> >>> > >>>>> On Jun 28, 2018, at 21:59, David Sovereen >>> > >>>>> <david.sover...@mercury.net> wrote: >>> > >>>>> >>> > >>>>> Same here. ACH saves us a bundle, and once customers are used to >>> the >>> > >>>>> recurring payment, there are few bounces. Once a payment does >>> bounce, >>> > >>>>> however, we only take cash or card... guaranteed funds. >>> > >>>>> >>> > >>>>> Dave >>> > >>>>> >>> > >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>> > >>>>> >>> > >>>>> David Sovereen >>> > >>>>> >>> > >>>>> Mercury Network Corporation >>> > >>>>> 2719 Ashman Street, Midland, MI 48640 >>> > >>>>> 989.837.3790 x151 office | 888.866.4638 toll free | >>> 989.837.3780 fax >>> > >>>>> >>> > >>>>> Telephone | Internet | Security Alarm Monitoring >>> > >>>>> >>> > >>>>> david.sover...@mercury.net >>> > >>>>> www.mercury.net >>> > >>>>> >>> > >>>>> <image001.png> >>> > >>>>> >>> > >>>>>> On Jun 28, 2018, at 6:51 PM, Lewis Bergman < >>> lewis.berg...@gmail.com> >>> > >>>>>> wrote: >>> > >>>>>> >>> > >>>>>> That's true but if you assess a hefty enough penalty then they >>> pay >>> > >>>>>> you for it anyway. I used to make several thousand a month just >>> off >>> > >>>>>> of late fees and disconnect fees. We assessed a 25 dollar fee >>> for >>> > >>>>>> any NSF. >>> > >>>>>> >>> > >>>>>>> On Thu, Jun 28, 2018, 4:49 PM Matt Hoppes >>> > >>>>>>> <mattli...@rivervalleyinternet.net> wrote: Sure but it takes >>> two >>> > >>>>>>> days for the failure to come back, so the customer can use >>> that to >>> > >>>>>>> game the system if they feel so inclined. With a credit card >>> the >>> > >>>>>>> acceptance or rejection is instant. >>> > >>>>>>> >>> > >>>>>>>> On Jun 28, 2018, at 17:30, Lewis Bergman < >>> lewis.berg...@gmail.com> >>> > >>>>>>>> wrote: >>> > >>>>>>>> >>> > >>>>>>>> I guess it depends on your billing system, how it cuts off >>> people, >>> > >>>>>>>> etc. Mine would accept payment, then reverse it and cut >>> people off >>> > >>>>>>>> automatically. One of the few things it did well. I was >>> mostly ACH >>> > >>>>>>>> and it saved me a couple of grand a month if I remember >>> correctly. >>> > >>>>>>>> >>> > >>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jun 28, 2018 at 4:25 PM Matt Hoppes >>> > >>>>>>>>> <mattli...@rivervalleyinternet.net> wrote: Hey CH is a pain >>> in my >>> > >>>>>>>>> neck. Yes I don’t have to pay fees with the fees are very >>> small, >>> > >>>>>>>>> but I am not guaranteed my money, and then I have to chase >>> > >>>>>>>>> balances and add fees and remove payments. >>> > >>>>>>>>> >>> > >>>>>>>>>> On Jun 28, 2018, at 17:20, Eric Kuhnke < >>> eric.kuh...@gmail.com> >>> > >>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>> > >>>>>>>>>> >>> > >>>>>>>>>> https://engineering.gusto.com/how-ach-works-a-developer- >>> perspect >>> > >>>>>>>>>>ive-part-1/ >>> > >>>>>>>>>> >>> > >>>>>>>>>> Might be of interest for those of you whose billing systems >>> are >>> > >>>>>>>>>> set up for ACH direct debits via checking account numbers. >>> > > >>> > > -- >>> > > AF mailing list >>> > > AF@af.afmug.com >>> > > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>> >>> -- >>> AF mailing list >>> AF@af.afmug.com >>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>> >> >> -- >> AF mailing list >> AF@af.afmug.com >> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> > > > -- > > Adair Winter > VP, Network Operations / Co-Owner > Amarillo Wireless | 806.316.5071 > C: 806.231.7180 > http://www.amarillowireless.net > <http://www.amarillowireless.net> > > > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > >
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