Mostly humor, but it's kinda true too. As Mike said - it's another one of his things. I'm surprised you haven't seen that, though it may not be too often in AFMUG.
Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 6:00 PM Ken Hohhof <af...@kwisp.com> wrote: > That’s kind of harsh, or was that humor? > > > > *From:* AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman > *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 4:50 PM > *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com> > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] billing > > > > This guy probably doesn't run his own DNS ;P > > > > Josh Luthman > Office: 937-552-2340 > Direct: 937-552-2343 > 1100 Wayne St > Suite 1337 > Troy, OH 45373 > > > > > > On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 5:48 PM David Coudron < > david.coud...@advantenon.com> wrote: > > Yes, that is something we need to continually consider, and I am not > trying to resurrect the SaaS apps vs own it and run it yourself debate 😊. > However, we are pretty small. We have a few Techs, a > scheduling/technician support person and me. That means every hour spent > upgrading Linux, building a new VM, making sure backups are working, etc is > an hour not spent building the next tower. For me, it is a poor trade off, > I will gladly pay a monthly fee and let someone else do that. I also know > myself well enough to know I won’t do as good a job of patching VMs, > backing them up, and overall operational run of the servers as someone who > does that for a living. I expect that will change some day, but for now, > unfortunately that is where we are at. > > > > Regards, > > > > David Coudron > > *From:* AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> *On Behalf Of *Mike Hammett > *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:49 PM > *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com> > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] billing > > > > The cost of running an ISP is that you have to run an ISP. ;-) > > > > > > I see a lot of people trying to run server-less, and you just can't... at > least not while being responsible. If you've got one VM, the work in more > VMs isn't dramatically different. > > > > ----- > Mike Hammett > Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/> > <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> > <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> > <https://twitter.com/ICSIL> > Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/> > <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix> > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange> > <https://twitter.com/mdwestix> > The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/> > <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp> > > > <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg> > ------------------------------ > > *From: *"David Coudron" <david.coud...@advantenon.com> > *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" <af@af.afmug.com> > *Sent: *Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:35:53 PM > *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] billing > > I hear ya, but it is another system to support/upgrade/backup etc. We’d > really like to be in the business of building the ISP network and get out > of the server/application support business. We have looked at quite a few > monitoring systems, but haven’t found a good mix of hosted, robust, and > reasonably priced. Additionally, you need to either put them in the > central office and live with more traffic flowing over your DIA, or find > some sort of distributed SNMP polling solution. One of the biggest > reasons to move to Sonar for us was to get access to Pulse, and next > generation network monitoring. To some extent we feel like moved to a > feature for feature comparison of where we were at with Powercode and a > slightly less reliable monitoring systems since we don’t have the local > BMUs grabbing the data. We have moved Sonar pollers out further into the > network to help with reliability, but now we have Linux devices we have to > remotely maintain again. I know I am whining about this, but we thought > we would be a lot closer to our ideal use case than where we ended up, and > I am a little sore that so many things appear to be part of v2 and it just > keeps being pushed a little beyond our reach. > > > > Ideally we would like this to be the case, if it is possible and we > haven’t stumbled on it yet, we’d love to hear about it. > > > > 1. SNMP monitoring data collected on the Mikrotiks and passed to a > central database. Reasoning – We have them everywhere, we already > committed to maintaining them and they are close to the devices we want to > get data from. > 2. SNMP monitoring system lives inside of our billing system so that > we have the tie from customer router to SM to tower AP to tower router, to > core routers to edge routers all sitting in the same system and tied to the > customer. We thought Sonar was going to be that. > 3. Ability to supplement the Sonar data with some simple math where > the SNMP data doesn’t provide exactly what were are looking for. In > particular, or Mimosa backhauls don’t provide simple utilization data, so > we calculate that ourselves in LibreNMS. > > > > I am sure we are looking for pie in the sky stuff, but I thought we’d be > closer to this with Pulse than where we landed by quite a bit. > > > > Regards, > > > > David Coudron > > > > *From:* AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> *On Behalf Of *Mike Hammett > *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:21 PM > *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com> > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] billing > > > > "We’d like to eliminate our external monitoring system (LibreNMS)." > > > > I've actually been advocating for the exact opposite. Use APIs to pull the > up\down information into Sonar, but leave the work of monitoring to > something purpose-built to monitor. > > > > ----- > Mike Hammett > Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/> > <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> > <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> > <https://twitter.com/ICSIL> > Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/> > <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix> > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange> > <https://twitter.com/mdwestix> > The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/> > <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp> > > > <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg> > ------------------------------ > > *From: *"David Coudron" <david.coud...@advantenon.com> > *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" <af@af.afmug.com> > *Sent: *Thursday, April 23, 2020 12:51:29 PM > *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] billing > > I need to go back to the session we had with the Sonar help folks. It > had to do with monitoring and using the API to update fields on devices so > that we could get better monitoring data into Sonar. In working with the > person at Sonar (I don’t have written down which one) we both agreed that > it appear it should be working, but clearly wasn’t. Their take was that > this wouldn’t be corrected in v1. We needed to wait for the v2 API. > > > > We’d like to eliminate our external monitoring system (LibreNMS). We’d > really like all of the data to be in Sonar and go to one spot for SNMP > based data. Preseem is our tool for latency, throughput, data volume and > overall customer experience. But all SNMP stuff would be nice to have in > one spot. What we’d really like to do is use the data pulled through SNMP > and landing in Sonar and do some math on it and store it back to Sonar. > That would be ideal, but it doesn’t look like that is possible. > > > > Regards, > > > > David Coudron > > *From:* AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> *On Behalf Of *Cassidy B. Larson > *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 12:38 PM > *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com> > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] billing > > > > We’ve been able to figure out most of our things we need with v1 API, but > it’s at the cost of an exponential number of API calls. This ends up being > bad for both us and our sonar instance. I think we tax it too heavily as > we’re API intensive :) > > > > On Apr 23, 2020, at 11:15 AM, Cameron Crum <cc...@murcevilo.com> wrote: > > > > David, > > > > I'm curious what you can't do with the v1 API. I have yet to find > something I haven't been able to help people with in custom integrations > with Sonar's API. Obviously, things will change with v2, but I'd be curious > to know what you are needing. > > > > On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 7:19 AM David Coudron < > david.coud...@advantenon.com> wrote: > > We see the same thing as Mike is referring to. We would really like to > get to v2.0. There has been quite a bit of discussion about it and > webinars saying it is ready and so on, but when you really press on the > topic, you find out many of the necessary features aren’t ready and you > can’t migrate. We have been in this state for months, and it doesn’t seem > like anything will change anytime soon. Our recommendation is, make > absolutely sure the current feature set works for you, do not assume you > will be using v2.0 because that timeline isn’t set. > > > > We want to move to v2.0 to take advantage of the new API stuff, as we’d > like to do some simple integration that doesn’t work with the v1.x API. > We are also hoping we will see improvement in the stability of the > monitoring in v2.0. We have found that the monitoring in the current > version isn’t nearly as reliable as Powercode and we have had to supplement > it with another tool. > > > > That being said, we can’t say enough about the integration with Preseem, > as Preseem has been an indispensable addition to our toolset. I imagine > you could use Preseem pretty successfully without Powercode or Sonar, but > the Sonar to Preseem integration makes it so easy to put Preseem in, and > Preseem has a lot of value. It is our most used monitoring and > troubleshooting tool. > > > > Regards, > > > > David Coudron > > > > > > *From:* AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> *On Behalf Of *Mike Hammett > *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 7:06 AM > *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com> > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] billing > > > > No one I know is running 2.0 because it isn't finished and doesn't seem > likely to be finished by fall. > > > > ----- > Mike Hammett > Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/> > <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> > <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> > <https://twitter.com/ICSIL> > Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/> > <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix> > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange> > <https://twitter.com/mdwestix> > The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/> > <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp> > > > <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg> > ------------------------------ > > *From: *"Sterling Jacobson" <sterl...@avative.net> > *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" <af@af.afmug.com> > *Sent: *Wednesday, April 22, 2020 11:42:13 PM > *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] billing > > Text to customer isn’t a feature yet. > > > > Are you running v2.0 Sonar already? > > > > > > > > *From:* AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> *On Behalf Of *Sean Heskett > *Sent:* Wednesday, April 22, 2020 7:04 PM > *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com> > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] billing > > > > if you only want to do billing Platypus is still around and is relatively > cheap, but it is literally a billing platform only. > > > > Sonar is a total CRM as well as business management platform...the whole > enchilada. > > > > -sean > > > > > > On Wed, Apr 22, 2020 at 6:58 PM <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote: > > I used Plat years ago and was happy with it. > > So glad to hear you are happy with Sonar. > > Simon is a standup guy. > > > > *From:* Sean Heskett > > *Sent:* Wednesday, April 22, 2020 6:55 PM > > *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group > > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] billing > > > > Sonar is awesome, you won't be disappointed. > > > > we started with platypus, moved to powercode, it was an upgrade from plat > but was way too clunky and at the time powercode couldn't do RADIUS so, > after 18 months of trying to make our business model fit to the powercode > way we moved to Sonar and haven't looked back. > > > > Sonar is very forward thinking with their service and they have just about > every integration under the sun you could think of (text to customer, fleet > tracking, preseem QoS, snail mail marketing etc.) > > > > -Sean > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Apr 22, 2020 at 5:59 PM <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote: > > I will probably be launching a new network this calendar year. So at some > point I will once again have to try to choose the best billing platform. > > > > Leaking toward Sonar. Have used Plat in the past. Is Powercode still > alive? > > Opinions? > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > ------------------------------ > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > > > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > > > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >
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