Well, comparing bits/mhz/$, I really don't think anything else comes close
to the AF11... the B11 might beat it on bits/$ (it's close anyway, and it
has the advantage of more overall capacity... and SFP), and plenty of other
radios can beat it on bits/mhz, but comparing all three the AF11 is a
pretty clear winner.

So what it really comes down to, is if it can handle enough bandwidth for a
given link in the available spectrum.

On Sat, Jan 14, 2017 at 5:07 AM, Gino Villarini <[email protected]> wrote:

> I’ll guess that is the way to get them produced at way lower price…
>
> I always use the bits/mhz/$ when comparing radios
>
> From: Af <[email protected]> on behalf of Josh Reynolds <
> [email protected]>
> Reply-To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
> Date: Saturday, January 14, 2017 at 12:56 AM
> To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Our UBNT AF11x experience
>
> There's an ongoing discussion about this. It seems it has to do with the
> hitless ARQ modulation change support.
>
> Basically, it's a trade-off.
>
>
>
> *Gino Villarini*
> President
> Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968
>
> On Jan 13, 2017 10:14 PM, "Mike Hammett" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> I love how Gary says they use so much better, newer technology...  but
>> they get worse throughput.  *sigh*
>>
>>
>>
>> -----
>> Mike Hammett
>> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
>> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>
>> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>
>> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
>> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
>> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>
>> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>
>> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
>> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
>> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>
>>
>>
>> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
>> ------------------------------
>> *From: *"Tim Hardy" <[email protected]>
>> *To: *[email protected]
>> *Sent: *Friday, January 13, 2017 5:54:53 PM
>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Our UBNT AF11x experience
>>
>> Post 6 here discusses the use of ARQ rather than FEC.
>>
>> https://community.ubnt.com/t5/airFiber/AF11x-Capacity/td-p/1737631
>> ------------------------------
>> *From:* Af <[email protected]> on behalf of George Skorup <
>> [email protected]>
>> *Sent:* Friday, January 13, 2017 6:41:10 PM
>> *To:* [email protected]
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Our UBNT AF11x experience
>>
>> Which I don't understand. Sounds like strong FEC?
>>
>> On 1/13/2017 5:36 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
>>
>> According to Link Planner, PTP820S (IP20S) gets around 243M at 256QAM,
>> 347M at 2048QAM (350M with header compression).  So add that to George’s
>> Trango/Exalt/SAF list.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Af [mailto:[email protected] <[email protected]>] *On
>> Behalf Of *Chris Gustaf
>> *Sent:* Friday, January 13, 2017 5:20 PM
>> *To:* [email protected]
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Our UBNT AF11x experience
>>
>>
>>
>> Real usable capacity at Layer 2 Ethernet depends on several variables
>> besides the modulation level and the regulatory bandwidth.  For 1024 QAM
>> there are 10 bits per symbol so theoretically one would expect to get 400
>> Mbps in a 40 MHz channel (10 bits x 40 MHz symbol rate).
>>
>>
>>
>> To actually make a radio that meets FCC spectrum masks, a reduction of
>> the symbol rate down to around 35 MHz is required plus filtering, giving a
>> max of 350 Mbps over the air.
>>
>>
>>
>> After that, Forward Error Correction (FEC) is required which is typically
>> around 85-90 % for most microwave radios using LDPC, giving a net
>> throughput of around 300 to 315 Mbps.
>>
>>
>>
>> Add header compression at layer 2 which in the worst case for large
>> packets adds about 2.5 % improvement and you get to around 325 Mbps, which
>> is what Trango and others get on a single 40 MHz channel with the newest
>> technology.
>>
>>
>>
>> Ubiquiti maybe using a lower FEC rate like 75-80% (or a lower symbol rate
>> if the filtering is not steep enough) and no header compression, which
>> would give them about 250 Mbps for large packets.
>>
>>
>>
>> Hope that helps!
>>
>>
>>
>> Chris Gustaf
>>
>> Trango Systems
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Jan 13, 2017 at 2:39 PM, Mathew Howard <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> What other radios will only do 250Mbps (502.4Mbps capacity according to
>> the data sheet...) on one 40mhz single polarity channel at 256qam? The
>> other's I've looked at are typically around 300Mbps...
>>
>> Not that I'm saying the AF11 is a bad radio, I plan on putting up at
>> least a few of them this year... but I find it a little funny that they use
>> 1024qam as a selling point, when it can't do as much throughput at 1024qam
>> as other radios do at 256qam.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Jan 13, 2017 at 4:19 PM, Eric Kuhnke <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> I think this whole thread can be summed up that there's no magical way to
>> get around the shannon limit and bps/Hz coding efficiency for a given
>> channel size and modulation...   From the technical perspective of people
>> who have to really understand the FDX capacity of a new PTP link, the ubnt
>> marketing department is divorced from reality, it's not 1200 Mbps no matter
>> how many slick PDFs they publish.
>>
>> One 40 MHz channel single polarity at 1024QAM 5/6 code rate is going to
>> be nearly the same efficiency bps/Hz from many different manufacturers.
>> Multiply as necessary for dual polarity or for larger channel sizes such as
>> 60, 80 or 112 MHz.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Jan 13, 2017 at 9:38 AM, Faisal Imtiaz <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> FYI... on a "single"  40mhz channel 'dual polarity' (mimo) the expected
>> throughput on Af11x is 500meg duplex.
>>
>>
>>
>> Faisal Imtiaz
>> Snappy Internet & Telecom
>> 7266 SW 48 Street
>> Miami, FL 33155
>> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <%28305%29%20663-5518>
>>
>> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 <%28305%29%20663-5518> Option 2 or Email:
>> [email protected]
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> *From: *"Josh Baird" <[email protected]>
>> *To: *[email protected]
>> *Sent: *Friday, January 13, 2017 10:30:10 AM
>>
>>
>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Our UBNT AF11x experience
>>
>> But if I can get 80mhz channels in both polarities (running at
>> 56Mhz/1024QAM with this radio), I should be able to at least double he
>> capacity of my PTP-800 link which can do 228Mbps.  Right?
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Jan 12, 2017 at 5:55 PM, Mike Hammett <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> At 40 MHz and a single polarity, you're looking at an almost
>> insignificant increase in throughput.
>>
>> Their claim is 1.2 gb+.
>> Cut that in half as they're advertising the aggregate, so 600 mb+.
>> That's using both polarities, so now only 300 mb+.
>> Only I haven't heard of anyone getting much more than 500 in a single
>> direction (they may certainly exist, I just haven't seen them), so now that
>> 300 is really only 250.
>>
>>
>> Not much of an upgrade unless you can also get larger channels in both
>> polarities.
>>
>>
>>
>> -----
>> Mike Hammett
>> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
>>
>> *Midwest Internet Exchange*
>>
>> *The Brothers WISP*
>>
>>
>>
>> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>> *From: *"Josh Baird" <*[email protected]*>
>> *To: **[email protected]*
>> *Sent: *Thursday, January 12, 2017 11:47:42 AM
>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Our UBNT AF11x experience
>> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>> This PTP800 is only capable of running at 40Mhz (ODU-A) so it can only do
>> 228Mbps full-duplex.  The AF11x should be able to do much more than that,
>> right? <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>> On Thu, Jan 12, 2017 at 12:05 PM, Gino Villarini <*[email protected]*>
>> wrote: <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>> IIRC, PTP800 is Remec Style, you'll need Remec to N connector adapters
>> (AF11x is N) <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>> What do you expect to achieve with this upgrade?  Not much capacity
>>  difference between PTP800 and AF11x, maybe 50-80- mbps more.  Only if you
>> have a xpic license you can double your throughput with the af11x
>> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>> *From: *Af <*[email protected]*> on behalf of Josh Baird <
>> *[email protected]*>
>> *Reply-To: *"*[email protected]*" <*[email protected]*>
>> *Date: *Thursday, January 12, 2017 at 9:12 AM
>> *To: *"*[email protected]*" <*[email protected]*>
>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Our UBNT AF11x experience
>> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>> Good news - thanks for sharing. <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>> Somewhat un-related question: <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>> I have a PTP-800 link using these dishes:
>> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>
>> *http://www.hol4g.com/AC/product.aspx?number=ANC-VHLP3-11W-RR1&p=237127&sc=0*
>> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>> Do you know if I can re-use these dishes with the AF11x?  Do I need
>> adapters? <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>> Josh <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>
>>
>> *Gino Villarini*
>>
>> President
>>
>> Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>> On Thu, Jan 12, 2017 at 8:07 AM, Gino Villarini <*[email protected]*>
>> wrote: <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>> Hey all, just dropping by to share our experience with AF11x, we habe
>> been beta testing the unit since Sept and for the last 3 months, the unit
>> has been rock solid.    <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>> We are very happy with its performance, just wished it had a SFP port!
>> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>> This unit replaced a Mimosa B11 unit that we were having some intermitent
>> throughtput issues,  <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>> The swap was easy since we reused the Jirous Dishes and only had to add
>> the af11x adapters to it,  <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>> The link  went live on 9/21/16 and on the first weeks we experienced some
>> lockups, but after a revised beta fw was applied, all issues went away.
>> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>> For UBNT, please add SFP port and continue the good work towards a af6x
>> and af18x <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>
>>
>> *Gino Villarini*
>>
>> President
>>
>> Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>   <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>
>>
>>
>>

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