To be fair... I am not sure if that would be a good idea... Considering Bill Clinton found a creative use for the cigar !
Faisal Imtiaz Snappy Internet & Telecom 7266 SW 48 Street Miami, FL 33155 Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net > From: "Ken Hohhof" <af...@kwisp.com> > To: af@afmug.com > Sent: Saturday, January 14, 2017 2:16:28 PM > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Our UBNT AF11x experience > Give that man a cigar. > From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Bill Prince > Sent: Saturday, January 14, 2017 1:06 PM > To: af@afmug.com > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Our UBNT AF11x experience > How about we just call him a self-promoting huckster. Hucksters are, in a way, > business men, but not in a way that would insult real business men. > bp > <part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com> > On 1/14/2017 10:59 AM, Ken Hohhof wrote: >> That’s an insult to businessmen. >> I suppose you consider the people who throw sticks of dynamite in the water >> fishermen? >> From: Af [ mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On Behalf Of Faisal Imtiaz >> Sent: Saturday, January 14, 2017 11:18 AM >> To: af@afmug.com >> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Our UBNT AF11x experience >> You just voted to put a self promoting business man to the highest office of >> the >> land.. >> and you are literally 'harping' on another business who is self promoting >> their >> product.... >> What gives ..... >> Maybe UBNT should be saying... "The AF11x is the best radio, As a matter of >> fact >> they only make the greatest Radios, and only they know how to make those >> radios.. Those are all phenomenal products, very successful " ... Let's all >> "Make Broadband Great Again" >> Would that help you in getting off their case ? >> :) >> Faisal Imtiaz >> Snappy Internet & Telecom >> 7266 SW 48 Street >> Miami, FL 33155 >> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 >> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net >>> From: "Mike Hammett" < af...@ics-il.net > >>> To: af@afmug.com >>> Sent: Saturday, January 14, 2017 8:52:02 AM >>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Our UBNT AF11x experience >>> Sure, but don't claim you're better when you're not. There's nothing wrong >>> with >>> building a reasonable product for a great price if that's all you claim to >>> be. >>> ----- >>> Mike Hammett >>> Intelligent Computing Solutions >>> Midwest Internet Exchange >>> The Brothers WISP >>> From: "Ken Hohhof" < af...@kwisp.com > >>> To: af@afmug.com >>> Sent: Friday, January 13, 2017 10:44:49 PM >>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Our UBNT AF11x experience >>> Price >>> Throughput >>> System Margin >>> Latency >>> Build Quality >>> Management >>> Vendor Support >>> It’s about the tradeoffs, and what you care about most. >>> From: Af [ mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett >>> Sent: Friday, January 13, 2017 10:15 PM >>> To: af@afmug.com >>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Our UBNT AF11x experience >>> I love how Gary says they use so much better, newer technology... but they >>> get >>> worse throughput. *sigh* >>> ----- >>> Mike Hammett >>> Intelligent Computing Solutions >>> Midwest Internet Exchange >>> The Brothers WISP >>> From: "Tim Hardy" < tha...@comsearch.com > >>> To: af@afmug.com >>> Sent: Friday, January 13, 2017 5:54:53 PM >>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Our UBNT AF11x experience >>> Post 6 here discusses the use of ARQ rather than FEC. >>> https://community.ubnt.com/t5/airFiber/AF11x-Capacity/td-p/1737631 >>> From: Af < af-boun...@afmug.com > on behalf of George Skorup < >>> geo...@cbcast.com >>> > >>> Sent: Friday, January 13, 2017 6:41:10 PM >>> To: af@afmug.com >>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Our UBNT AF11x experience >>> Which I don't understand. Sounds like strong FEC? >>> On 1/13/2017 5:36 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote: >>>> According to Link Planner, PTP820S (IP20S) gets around 243M at 256QAM, >>>> 347M at >>>> 2048QAM (350M with header compression). So add that to George’s >>>> Trango/Exalt/SAF list. >>>> From: Af [ mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On Behalf Of Chris Gustaf >>>> Sent: Friday, January 13, 2017 5:20 PM >>>> To: af@afmug.com >>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Our UBNT AF11x experience >>>> Real usable capacity at Layer 2 Ethernet depends on several variables >>>> besides >>>> the modulation level and the regulatory bandwidth. For 1024 QAM there are >>>> 10 >>>> bits per symbol so theoretically one would expect to get 400 Mbps in a 40 >>>> MHz >>>> channel (10 bits x 40 MHz symbol rate). >>>> To actually make a radio that meets FCC spectrum masks, a reduction of the >>>> symbol rate down to around 35 MHz is required plus filtering, giving a max >>>> of >>>> 350 Mbps over the air. >>>> After that, Forward Error Correction (FEC) is required which is typically >>>> around >>>> 85-90 % for most microwave radios using LDPC, giving a net throughput of >>>> around >>>> 300 to 315 Mbps. >>>> Add header compression at layer 2 which in the worst case for large >>>> packets adds >>>> about 2.5 % improvement and you get to around 325 Mbps, which is what >>>> Trango >>>> and others get on a single 40 MHz channel with the newest technology. >>>> Ubiquiti maybe using a lower FEC rate like 75-80% (or a lower symbol rate >>>> if the >>>> filtering is not steep enough) and no header compression, which would give >>>> them >>>> about 250 Mbps for large packets. >>>> Hope that helps! >>>> Chris Gustaf >>>> Trango Systems >>>> On Fri, Jan 13, 2017 at 2:39 PM, Mathew Howard < mhoward...@gmail.com > >>>> wrote: >>>>> What other radios will only do 250Mbps (502.4Mbps capacity according to >>>>> the data >>>>> sheet...) on one 40mhz single polarity channel at 256qam? The other's I've >>>>> looked at are typically around 300Mbps... >>>>> Not that I'm saying the AF11 is a bad radio, I plan on putting up at >>>>> least a few >>>>> of them this year... but I find it a little funny that they use 1024qam >>>>> as a >>>>> selling point, when it can't do as much throughput at 1024qam as other >>>>> radios >>>>> do at 256qam. >>>>> On Fri, Jan 13, 2017 at 4:19 PM, Eric Kuhnke < eric.kuh...@gmail.com > >>>>> wrote: >>>>>> I think this whole thread can be summed up that there's no magical way >>>>>> to get >>>>>> around the shannon limit and bps/Hz coding efficiency for a given >>>>>> channel size >>>>>> and modulation... From the technical perspective of people who have to >>>>>> really >>>>>> understand the FDX capacity of a new PTP link, the ubnt marketing >>>>>> department is >>>>>> divorced from reality, it's not 1200 Mbps no matter how many slick PDFs >>>>>> they >>>>>> publish. >>>>>> One 40 MHz channel single polarity at 1024QAM 5/6 code rate is going to >>>>>> be >>>>>> nearly the same efficiency bps/Hz from many different manufacturers. >>>>>> Multiply >>>>>> as necessary for dual polarity or for larger channel sizes such as 60, >>>>>> 80 or >>>>>> 112 MHz. >>>>>> On Fri, Jan 13, 2017 at 9:38 AM, Faisal Imtiaz < >>>>>> fai...@snappytelecom.net > >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> FYI... on a "single" 40mhz channel 'dual polarity' (mimo) the expected >>>>>>> throughput on Af11x is 500meg duplex. >>>>>>> Faisal Imtiaz >>>>>>> Snappy Internet & Telecom >>>>>>> 7266 SW 48 Street >>>>>>> Miami, FL 33155 >>>>>>> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 >>>>>>> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net >>>>>>>> From: "Josh Baird" < joshba...@gmail.com > >>>>>>>> To: af@afmug.com >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, January 13, 2017 10:30:10 AM >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Our UBNT AF11x experience >>>>>>>> But if I can get 80mhz channels in both polarities (running at >>>>>>>> 56Mhz/1024QAM >>>>>>>> with this radio), I should be able to at least double he capacity of >>>>>>>> my PTP-800 >>>>>>>> link which can do 228Mbps. Right? >>>>>>>> On Thu, Jan 12, 2017 at 5:55 PM, Mike Hammett < af...@ics-il.net > >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> At 40 MHz and a single polarity, you're looking at an almost >>>>>>>>> insignificant >>>>>>>>> increase in throughput. >>>>>>>>> Their claim is 1.2 gb+. >>>>>>>>> Cut that in half as they're advertising the aggregate, so 600 mb+. >>>>>>>>> That's using both polarities, so now only 300 mb+. >>>>>>>>> Only I haven't heard of anyone getting much more than 500 in a single >>>>>>>>> direction >>>>>>>>> (they may certainly exist, I just haven't seen them), so now that 300 >>>>>>>>> is really >>>>>>>>> only 250. >>>>>>>>> Not much of an upgrade unless you can also get larger channels in both >>>>>>>>> polarities. >>>>>>>>> ----- >>>>>>>>> Mike Hammett >>>>>>>>> Intelligent Computing Solutions >>>>>>>>> Midwest Internet Exchange >>>>>>>>> The Brothers WISP >>>>>>>>> From: "Josh Baird" <joshba...@gmail.com> >>>>>>>>> To: af@afmug.com >>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, January 12, 2017 11:47:42 AM >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Our UBNT AF11x experience >>>>>>>>> This PTP800 is only capable of running at 40Mhz (ODU-A) so it can >>>>>>>>> only do >>>>>>>>> 228Mbps full-duplex. The AF11x should be able to do much more than >>>>>>>>> that, right? >>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jan 12, 2017 at 12:05 PM, Gino Villarini <g...@aeronetpr.com> >>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> IIRC, PTP800 is Remec Style, you'll need Remec to N connector >>>>>>>>>> adapters (AF11x is >>>>>>>>>> N) >>>>>>>>>> What do you expect to achieve with this upgrade? Not much capacity >>>>>>>>>> difference >>>>>>>>>> between PTP800 and AF11x, maybe 50-80- mbps more. Only if you have a >>>>>>>>>> xpic >>>>>>>>>> license you can double your throughput with the af11x >>>>>>>>>> From: Af <af-boun...@afmug.com> on behalf of Josh Baird >>>>>>>>>> <joshba...@gmail.com> >>>>>>>>>> Reply-To: "af@afmug.com" <af@afmug.com> >>>>>>>>>> Date: Thursday, January 12, 2017 at 9:12 AM >>>>>>>>>> To: "af@afmug.com" <af@afmug.com> >>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Our UBNT AF11x experience >>>>>>>>>> Good news - thanks for sharing. >>>>>>>>>> Somewhat un-related question: >>>>>>>>>> I have a PTP-800 link using these dishes: >>>>>>>>>> http://www.hol4g.com/AC/product.aspx?number=ANC-VHLP3-11W-RR1&p=237127&sc=0 >>>>>>>>>> Do you know if I can re-use these dishes with the AF11x? Do I need >>>>>>>>>> adapters? >>>>>>>>>> Josh >>>>>>>>>> Gino Villarini >>>>>>>>>> President >>>>>>>>>> Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968 >>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jan 12, 2017 at 8:07 AM, Gino Villarini <g...@aeronetpr.com> >>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> Hey all, just dropping by to share our experience with AF11x, we >>>>>>>>>>> habe been beta >>>>>>>>>>> testing the unit since Sept and for the last 3 months, the unit has >>>>>>>>>>> been rock >>>>>>>>>>> solid. >>>>>>>>>>> We are very happy with its performance, just wished it had a SFP >>>>>>>>>>> port! >>>>>>>>>>> This unit replaced a Mimosa B11 unit that we were having some >>>>>>>>>>> intermitent >>>>>>>>>>> throughtput issues, >>>>>>>>>>> The swap was easy since we reused the Jirous Dishes and only had to >>>>>>>>>>> add the >>>>>>>>>>> af11x adapters to it, >>>>>>>>>>> The link went live on 9/21/16 and on the first weeks we experienced >>>>>>>>>>> some >>>>>>>>>>> lockups, but after a revised beta fw was applied, all issues went >>>>>>>>>>> away. >>>>>>>>>>> For UBNT, please add SFP port and continue the good work towards a >>>>>>>>>>> af6x and >>>>>>>>>>> af18x >>>>>>>>>>> Gino Villarini >>>>>>>>>>> President >>>>>>>>>>> Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968
