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Mark, In our area, limited new house construction. So, we design our plant to serve existing houses. You of course have the option of putting in all the taps you might need now, rather than cutting them in later. We usually end up with at least one drop coming back to maybe 80% of the handholes. I have not yet, one year in using this method, had to cut service to install a new tap. If you are good at splicing it "should" be only a couple minutes of downtime. I'm never claiming it's the right choice for everyone, or right choice for everywhere in your network. I just know it lets me go many miles and a 200-300 homes served on a 12 count mainline that costs me <20 cents a foot. I think that's pretty awesome, and it's almost never even discussed as an option by most FTTH people.
On Thu, Feb 15, 2018 at 1:04 PM, Mark - Myakka Technologies <m...@mailmt.com> wrote:
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Chris,
It all depends on scale. Not saying taps won't work, just saying I could never figure out a good way of scaling them beyond maybe 12-16 customers. Always was afraid to deal with having to take everyone south of the new tap offline. In the scheme I just posted, everything flows south. Taps would be great in a static environment where you can install them once and not worry about new customers. The area I designed for was only 30% built out. Also, this is the exception to the rule. I would NEVER advise people to build their whole network like this.
--
Best regards,
Mark mailto:m...@mailmt.com
Myakka Technologies, Inc.
www.MyakkaTech.com
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Thursday, February 15, 2018, 12:53:12 PM, you wrote:
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Chuck, I would love to hear your lower cost idea. Right now we use mainly HDPE handholes, not load rated, and place them so it's unlikely to see heavy traffic. We have had one crushed so far by a tractor, so its not perfect (but the fiber was OKAY). But they are $75ea vs $200 for a polymer concrete, worth having to replace one or two a year.
This video I only recently found, but it explains this tapping architecture very well. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k78dC2z1mWc I wish I had seen this video 5 years ago. It seemed a lot more "wierd" when we were suggested the idea by another fiber upstart guy.
Mark, I've done lots of drawings of distributed splits inside a 12-count main and folding legs back along the mainline and what not. Certainly a viable approach. I think it is overly complicated, especially when at some handholes you are splicing drops to go north and at some you are splicing to go south and what not. I think the tapped trunk layout is working very well for us in our area, certainly has some compromises but I'm happy with it. You do have to have the loss values worked out upfront. If you leave some extra margin you can tolerate cutting in an extra splitter here or there as houses are built and what not.
Chuck, its very much same idea as Coax taps in CATV, the math pretty much the same.
Chris
On Thu, Feb 15, 2018 at 10:44 AM, <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote:
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What are you using for handholes? Full traffic rated handholes are a large expense.
I am working on a lower cost idea, but if something equivalent to my idea already exists I would rather just buy them.
From: Chris Fabien
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2018 9:01 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Outdoor PON OLT
Regarding the distance, our ZTE will support up to 60 km, but max difference of 20km between ONU on one PON. There's just a range parameter that needs to be set.
We ordered C+ optics and see a real optical budget of 33dB. The OLT is about +5.5 tx and -34 min rx sensitivity. The ONU about + 0.5 tx and -28 rx sens.
I've been very impressed with the optical performance.
We did test the ubnt as well. Went with ZTE
On Feb 12, 2018 1:23 PM, "Adam Moffett" <dmmoff...@gmail.com> wrote:
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That's also a compelling point.
It's not a simple question for sure.
The other reason I would think about GPON is that if a larger company wanted to purchase our network down the road I have to think about what THEY will prefer. They'll probably prefer PON.
Humans are horrible at assessing their own biases, but I probably have a bias towards ethernet because it's familiar. I try to bear that in mind too.
------ Original Message ------
From: "Chuck McCown" <ch...@wbmfg.com>
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 2/12/2018 1:13:18 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Outdoor PON OLT
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When doing full throttle Calix GPON we have about $570 invested in cpe electronics, splitter, ont/olt/onu etc. Everything but fiber and outdoor cabinets.
When doing active Ethernet you can come in closer to $100 per customer.
For non regulated greenfield, I am having a hard time convincing myself to do PON.
From: Mark - Myakka Technologies
Sent: Monday, February 12, 2018 11:09 AM
To: Chuck McCown
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Outdoor PON OLT
Chuck,
PLC splitter in spice case doing full fusion splicing.
--
Best regards,
Mark mailto:m...@mailmt.com
Myakka Technologies, Inc.
www.MyakkaTech.com
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Monday, February 12, 2018, 12:09:32 PM, you wrote:
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Are you using splitters in splice cases or in cross connect boxes?
From: Mark - Myakka Technologies
Sent: Monday, February 12, 2018 9:55 AM
To: Adam Moffett
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Outdoor PON OLT
Adam,
There are some ranging things you have to consider. "The requirement
when deploying ONTs are the maximum distance between two ONTs cannot
exceed 20Km."
The way we have done this is to reuse fibers as we travel down long stretches of roads between neighborhoods.
We will deploy a 1x32 splitter in the field. We will splice that into the last 3 ribbons/tubes of our fiber. Example, if we were using a 144 count cable, ribbons 10-12 will be spliced into. After a few miles depending on density or distance, we will splice in another 1x32 splitter to ribbons 10-12. We just keep doing this until we run out of light budget.
We build to the lots passed, so we are not trying to optimize max usage per port. Currently, we average about 50% utilization on our ports.
--
Best regards,
Mark mailto:m...@mailmt.com
Myakka Technologies, Inc.
www.MyakkaTech.com
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Monday, February 12, 2018, 11:38:39 AM, you wrote:
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Maybe I need to review the math.
I was figuring on several small splitters along the route. I didn't compare to a 1x32 in the cabinet because I figured if I brought every fiber back to the cabinet then I didn't save anything versus ethernet.
------ Original Message ------
From: "Mark - Myakka Technologies" <m...@mailmt.com>
To: "Adam Moffett" <af@afmug.com>
Sent: 2/12/2018 11:30:46 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Outdoor PON OLT
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Adam,
How far are you going? We are pushing almost 20 miles on a 1x32 split. Are you using one 1x32 or multiple smaller splitters?
--
Best regards,
Mark mailto:m...@mailmt.com
Myakka Technologies, Inc.
www.MyakkaTech.com
------
Sunday, February 11, 2018, 10:24:30 PM, you wrote:
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I'm looking at rural areas (like a few houses per mile). As I'm looking at hypothetical power budgets for PON, I'm finding that if I run the line down the road and put splitters on the pole I can split 5-6 times and then I'm getting too low on db to keep going down the road. At 5 or so houses per port, a 1U, 8 port ONT is no denser than a 1U switch.
Your stated reasons for PON are all correct. The numbers just aren't seeming to work out for me.
I also figure if I install enough fibers for AE, I can still switch to PON some day if I want to.
We would never max out the PON port, but looking back on the past 15 years of growth in consumption I wonder if I should ever say "never". In AE I can put 100Gig in every house if I have to. I'll "never" have to do that as far as I can imagine, but my imagination could be limited.
-Adam
------ Original Message ------
From: "Josh Reynolds" <j...@kyneticwifi.com>
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 2/11/2018 9:28:34 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Outdoor PON OLT
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A few reasons...
Port cost is still fairly high.
More splicing.
More fiber required.
Larger chassis required.
More power required.
More battery backup required.
Consumers not even close to using up 1-2 generations back of PON capacity in most places.
On Sun, Feb 11, 2018 at 7:53 PM, Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote:
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So, why do PON and not active in these super cheap optics days?
From: Chuck Hogg
Sent: Sunday, February 11, 2018 6:10 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Outdoor PON OLT
We are walking away from them and Alphion...I think Mark's product with Zhone is different.
Regards,
Chuck
On Sun, Feb 11, 2018 at 2:29 PM, Mike Hammett <af...@ics-il.net> wrote:
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