Shame on you Ben, again! He Creative Commons licensed his mind, that's why.

AT

> On 16.06.2014, at 14:52, "Ben Goertzel via AGI" <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> 
> I wonder why you enjoy talking to yourself on a public email list?   ;-)
> 
> 
>> On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 8:48 PM, Jim Bromer via AGI <[email protected]> wrote:
>> I am probably wrong. The solution to finding a solution to a logical 
>> satisfiability problem in polynomial time is probably going to be based on a 
>> natural solution that does an accounting of the number of solutions to the 
>> logical problem.
>> 
>> Jim Bromer
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sun, Jun 15, 2014 at 9:05 AM, Jim Bromer <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> Traditional logic is a compressed format. Since there are so many possible 
>>> equivalences we know that logic is not a perfectly packed compression 
>>> method. So there is no need for a list of alternative compression 
>>> conversion algorithms which were in a list of possible algorithms that was 
>>> in np. (I expressed that idea incorrectly. I should have talked about a 
>>> list of possible algorithms which were in exp space or something like that. 
>>> If the list of possible compression-conversion algorithms were in np then 
>>> that implies that finding an algorithm solution might itself be in np.)
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Jim Bromer
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Sun, Jun 15, 2014 at 8:36 AM, Jim Bromer <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>  >> Of course I have no idea if this is even possible. But my next 
>>>> question is whether the inclusion of the compression formatting with the 
>>>> compressed string is inherently too inefficient to be useful..
>>>> 
>>>> Presuming that different classes of logical formulas could be compressed 
>>>> in different ways, is it possible to use a single polynomial time 
>>>> algorithm to do this? It might be possible, for example, using a numerical 
>>>> method to choose an algorithm based on a numbering system (where an 
>>>> ordering of algorithms might, to continue with this conjectural example, 
>>>> be associated with a log-based number - an n-ary number - to choose the 
>>>> algorithm from a system of algorithms which are in their entirety in np). 
>>>> This is too complicated for me, but if the parts of the algorithms were 
>>>> ordered and enumerated then large numbers could be used to refer to a 
>>>> particular ordering scheme. I am just trying to establish that there could 
>>>> be a way to express variations in how a compression conversion method 
>>>> might be chosen even if the entire list of algorithms were themselves in 
>>>> np.
>>>> 
>>>> But, is a compression method which includes some way to describe or refer 
>>>> to the particular compression scheme used in the compression going to be 
>>>> so much less efficient than a system that leaves that kind of information 
>>>> out to make this whole idea theoretically impossible? I think that it is 
>>>> theoretically possible.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Jim Bromer
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On Sun, Jun 15, 2014 at 8:20 AM, Jim Bromer <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Jim Bromer
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Sat, Jun 14, 2014 at 9:20 PM, Jim Bromer <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>> I have spent some time looking at the problem of finding a polynomial 
>>>>>> time solution to logical satisfiability and I have come to a few 
>>>>>> conclusions about the problem.
>>>>>>  
>>>>>> There may be a natural solution, but if there is, I certainly can't see 
>>>>>> it.
>>>>>>  
>>>>>> So if this is at all feasible, a more contrived method needs to be 
>>>>>> concocted. I believe the solution would have to use an alternative way 
>>>>>> to compress a logical problem so that individual solutions could be 
>>>>>> turned out in polynomial time. I can imagine compressing-some- logical 
>>>>>> formulas that way but I can't think of a general method.
>>>>>>  
>>>>>> But, since it looks like there is no one compression formatting that 
>>>>>> could be used for every possible logical formula I believe that a 
>>>>>> solution - if one is feasible - would have to use different compression 
>>>>>> encryptions for different formulas. The formulas, encoded in one of 
>>>>>> these yet-to-be-invented compression formats would probably need to 
>>>>>> contain the encoding methods used to explain how they were encoded, 
>>>>>> since different formulas (or different classes of formulas) would have 
>>>>>> to be compressed differently.
>>>>>>  
>>>>>> But, then since a part of logical formula that had been partially 
>>>>>> expressed in one of these formats would, using this theoretical 
>>>>>> framework, need to be converted into another compression format for the 
>>>>>> next part of the formula, that suggests that the compressions would have 
>>>>>> to be converted into other compressions without fully decompressing them 
>>>>>> and this compression transformation would have to take place in 
>>>>>> polynomial time.  So one compressed format would have to be 
>>>>>> transformable into another format as the formula was converted in a step 
>>>>>> by step fashion.
>>>>>>  
>>>>>> So in conclusion:
>>>>>> 1. Different classes of logical formulas would have to be converted into 
>>>>>> different compression formats and this compression would have to be done 
>>>>>> efficiently.
>>>>>> 2. The new compressed formulas would have to be efficiently readable so, 
>>>>>> in the worse case, individual solutions could be read out efficiently.
>>>>>> 3. The individuated compression formats would have to include something 
>>>>>> about the encoding used for the formatting.
>>>>>> 4. These formats would have to be convertible into another format 
>>>>>> efficiently in order to process the logical formula in a stepwise 
>>>>>> fashion.
>>>>>>  
>>>>>> This shows that there are at least 3 different conversion or 
>>>>>> transformation methods necessary for the new individuated compression 
>>>>>> methods.
>>>>>>  
>>>>>> An initial analysis of the structure of a logical formula might be used 
>>>>>> to immediately convert the formula into a different format without going 
>>>>>> through a step by step conversion- reconversion process. But even if 
>>>>>> that was possible we would still want to be able to treat logical 
>>>>>> formulas in a step by step manner. 
>>>>>>  
>>>>>> Of course I have no idea if this is even possible. But my next question 
>>>>>> is whether the inclusion of the compression formatting with the 
>>>>>> compressed string is inherently too inefficient to be useful..
>>>>>>  
>>>>>> Jim Bromer
>> 
>> AGI | Archives  | Modify Your Subscription    
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Ben Goertzel, PhD
> http://goertzel.org
> 
> "In an insane world, the sane man must appear to be insane". -- Capt. James 
> T. Kirk
> 
> "Emancipate yourself from mental slavery / None but ourselves can free our 
> minds" -- Robert Nesta Marley
> AGI | Archives  | Modify Your Subscription     



-------------------------------------------
AGI
Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now
RSS Feed: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/21088071-f452e424
Modify Your Subscription: 
https://www.listbox.com/member/?member_id=21088071&id_secret=21088071-58d57657
Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com

Reply via email to