Ram:
I agree. The problem seems to be that each religious, ethinic, caste,
language group bring their own sets of problems to the table, with
absolutely no thought for other groups. In doing so, they seem to be
re-defining secularism, to mean that if their wants are satisfied,
there is secularism, else there is discrimination.
*** You are one of our more clear headed thinkers. But this paragraph
does not do you justice at all. You still are befuddled with the
meaning of secularism, while you charge others of misunderstanding,
aren't you?
Of course interest groups would fight to protect their turfs. That is
in the nature of democracy. But NOT on religious matters in a secular
state. That they would leave behind in their mandirs and masjids and
girjas or their gwxain-ghor. The sophisticated and intellectually
able would hold it in their hearts instead of wearing it on their
kurta sleeves.
>There is none. Unfortunately, in India (or even in the net), the
definition for secularism means different things to different people.
*** What do you attribute this to?
1: That damned English language? No comprendo!
2: Because they like to have it both ways--declare to the world
that theirs is an enlightened secular democratic state, but still
mess with their politics of religion in the affairs of state,
because that is the desi thing to do?
3: Something else?
>It shouldn't mean appeasing the minority, and nor should it mean
the majority can flount all rules.
*** What in the heck is this supposed to mean? You cannot, on the one hand
invoke the need for compromises in a democracy, and on the other
decry compromises made as 'appeasement'. You cannot get away with
that damned English language alibi here Ram :-). So what is it? Been
cultivating confusion for long?
But yes, the state must NOT play the religion game if it also has
pretenses of being a secular one. And do you NOT know why it has been
like this, even after posting that article by the SC justice who
explained the loopholes in the Indian constitution which allow this
to happen? Or is it more convenient to forget it?
Where are the statesmen , the luminaries of desi-demokrasy, who have
advocated reforms to close those loopholes to make it a real secular
state? Ever heard anyone proposing it?
Plus, those who find fault with secularism in India, ARE NOT the root cause.
All they are doing is look into every nook & crany on an endless fact?
finding mission. So, in essence, all they have to say is the system
ain't right, but have never tried nor offered any alternative
democratic solution.
**** My point exactly. See above.
Again, why do you suppose it is so?
Also what would YOUR solution be? Or are you going to excuse yourself
because you don't criticize the Indian state's partial or fake
secularism?
There is no alternative to secularism. But how many are trying to
strengthen >it?
*** You tell me.
c-da
At 11:41 AM -0500 6/14/05, Ram Sarangapani wrote:
C'da,
But what are the RELIGIONS doing to help resolve the religious
conflicts? What are the LEADERS of the nation doing to douse the
effects of religious intolerance and religion based political demands
? Who are fanning the fires of anti-secularist emotions?
I agree. The problem seems to be that each religious, ethinic, caste,
language group bring their own sets of problems to the table, with
absolutely no thought for other groups. In doing so, they seem to be
re-defining secularism, to mean that if their wants are satisfied,
there is secularism, else there is discrimination. I would sqarely
blame all such groups, whether they represent the majority or the
minority. None of them seem to be working toward a common goal, that
would benefit all in the long run.
And what is the alternative to the secular state?
There is none. Unfortunately, in India (or even in the net), the
definition for secularism means different things to different people.
IMHO: It shouldn't mean appeasing the minority, and nor should it mean
the majority can flount all rules.
it is not those who find > fault in Indian pretenses to secularism
that are at the >root of India's religious miseries:
There is no such pretense in India to secularism. Its individuals, be
it an RSS or someone from Bajrang dal. People like that are always on
the lookout to capitalize on the slightest opportunity to marginalize
the secular concept.
Plus, those who find fault with secularism in India, ARE NOT the root cause.
All they are doing is look into every nook & crany on an endless fact?
finding mission. So, in essence, all they have to say is the system
ain't right, but have never tried nor offered any alternative
democratic solution.
There is no alternative to secularism. But how many are trying to
strengthen it?
It is those who indulge in religious politics and their apologists.
I agree.
--Ram
On 6/14/05, Chan Mahanta <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Also, for those of us seem to be continually finding
>fault with secularism in India, would find the enormous difficulty the
>Govt. faces trying to balance this 'majority rule and minority
No doubt it is a difficult job.
But what are the RELIGIONS doing to help resolve the religious
conflicts? What are the LEADERS of the nation doing to douse the
effects of religious intolerance and religion based political demands
? Who are fanning the fires of anti-secularist emotions? And what is
the alternative to the secular state?
Finally, just in case it was not obvious, it is not those who find
fault in Indian pretenses to secularism that are at the root of
India's religious miseries: It is those who indulge in religious
politics and their apologists.
At 8:03 AM -0500 6/14/05, Ram Sarangapani wrote:
>Thank you Bhuban da.
>
>>what is more I find support for my own views on various matters as
>expressed >from time to time in the net from this author.
>
>I feel the same. Also, for those of us seem to be continually finding
>fault with secularism in India, would find the enormous difficulty the
>Govt. faces trying to balance this 'majority rule and minority
>rights'.
>
>--Ram
>
>
>On 6/14/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Ram
>>
>> I congratulate you for being able to find out an excellent
dissertation
>> like this covering comprehensibly such issues as minorities, reserved
>> constituencies, employment, personal laws, Kashmir, etc and
what is more I
>> find support for my own views on various matters as expressed
from time to
>> time in the net from this author.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> Bhuban
>
>_______________________________________________
>Assam mailing list
>[email protected]
>http://pikespeak.uccs.edu/mailman/listinfo/assam
>
>Mailing list FAQ:
>http://pikespeak.uccs.edu/assam/assam-faq.html
>To unsubscribe or change options:
>http://pikespeak.uccs.edu/mailman/options/assam
_______________________________________________
Assam mailing list
[email protected]
http://pikespeak.uccs.edu/mailman/listinfo/assam
Mailing list FAQ:
http://pikespeak.uccs.edu/assam/assam-faq.html
To unsubscribe or change options:
http://pikespeak.uccs.edu/mailman/options/assam
