another great tug is supercub with 180hp conversion with bora float plane prop. Climb real well and fun to fly. A few friends have them inc Chris Leon in Aus Ian M
On 02/10/2010, Yannick Sasso <yannick.sa...@internode.on.net> wrote: > What about this baby. > Even if it may not quite climb at 1,700fpm whilst towing, it would still > make a great, retrieve anything anywhere, new tug > > http://www.flyingmag.com/aircraft/lsa/sport/carbon-cub-ss > > > On 01/10/2010, at 6:16 PM, stephenk <steph...@internode.on.net> wrote: > >> Mike (and any others interested) >> As I sort of wrote below, the cost of the tailwheel conversion is only a >> few thousand compared to the overall cost of upgrading a 150/152. Still a >> few thousand could be worth saving, but it isn't a deal breaker. >> >> Had a bit more of a look at lunch time in a few more aviation traders. >> Looked at 23 in total, the average is a bit lower than with the first >> look, but still about $45k. There are, of course some cheaper airframes, >> but not so many as we might think (only 5 under $35k). And these are often >> late 1960's vintage 150s. Maybe no one is advertising teh really cheap >> ones. >> So we could conceivably dig around and do a conversion somewhere between >> Dave's 70k and my guess of 90k. However, what we would end up with is a >> very old 150 (albeit with a new engine) . And that isn't much (any?) >> better than a very old Pawnee (with a new engine). One of the drivers for >> Richard (and others) thinking about "a new tug" is that one tug at his >> club is pretty nearly worn out and will cost a significant proportion of a >> new plane for soon to be due maintenance. Is it worth sinking that much >> money into something as ancient as a Pawnee? >> I take the point that over the life of the two aircraft comparison the >> real costs of the 150 might be less than the Pawnee, but operating costs >> are also driving the current thoughts to use MGs and ULs. >> Are there no other options than bodging up 40+ year old aircraft (that's a >> whole other discussion and could involve Blaniks!)? >> >> The other side of the equation though, is that Richard asked the original >> question because having a MG as a _second_ tug possibly gives his club an >> aeroplane with greater utility. A tug MG is a tug _and_ a MG, a GA tug (of >> any sort) is only a tug. >> >> Regards >> SWK >> >> On 1/10/2010 1:18 PM, Mike Borgelt wrote: >>> Stephen, >>> >>> Dave Donald is at Boonah and they converted one in the last few years. >>> You don't need the tailwheel conversion and both Boonah and Kingaroy's >>> C150s are still nosewheel types. >>> >>> Performance of the 180HP C150 is impressive. I've watched a launch behind >>> a 235 Pawnee and the Kingaroy C150 with ballasted 15m gliders with the >>> second rolling as soon as the first lifted off. It isn't at all certain >>> that the 235 Pawnee is any better under those circumstances than the >>> C150. >>> >>> The O-360 Lycoming used is essentially 2/3 of the O-540 in the Pawnee. >>> Only 4 cylinders to fuel and overhaul instead of 6 for around the same >>> towing perfomance. >>> >>> Mike >>> >>> >>> At 12:59 PM 1/10/2010, you wrote: >>> >>>> I was a bit interested this morning too, so I did a quick hunt around on >>>> the internet. I think Daves guess is a bit on the low side. >>>> >>>> Airframe : going by costs of 150/152 from the latest aviation trader >>>> (about 12 aircraft) costs range from 30k to 65k but typically fell in >>>> the 45-55 range for aircraft with about 6000 hrs on the airframe. (the >>>> $30k one was a real outlier and would be a bit of a clunker I reckon, >>>> the 65k one "only" had 2000 hrs on the airframe, least used by a long >>>> way). >>>> >>>> So Airframe : average 48K, best 65k >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Had a look at Lycomings 2010 price list for O-360s (there are 140+ types >>>> ! not counting IO, AEIO etc) >>>> >>>> With exchange, a new O-360 $41k, rebuilt zero hours $29k. BUT up front >>>> they say they are reluctant to exchange different types, so add 20% to >>>> either of these prices for a straight out purchase (though you should >>>> still be able to sell the old engine locally and recoup something). >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Then looked for conversion prices. Found a site called Aeroprices which >>>> quoted a tailwheel kit as US$2225 and an engine upsize kit as >>>> US$5835-7622. HOWEVER (and this is the interesting bit) the STC for both >>>> these kits was owned by "Aircraft Conversion Technologies" who seem to >>>> have folded as a business in 1999. The STC ownership seems to have then >>>> passed to "Del Air" who have little in the way of info on the web (only >>>> reference by third parties). They could be gone too. Who owns the STC? >>>> The upshot being the prices given must be pre 1999 prices so a >>>> conservative 50% inflation since then (I would bet closer to 100%) >>>> gives: >>>> >>>> Tailwheel kit $3300 (which seems neither here nor there in the overall >>>> cost of the work) >>>> >>>> Engine fit kit $9800 >>>> >>>> ------------------------- >>>> >>>> Finally if we were to buy a 150/152 on the Australian market and upgrade >>>> it as above (not counting labour!) an "average/cheap" conversion would >>>> be about $90k and a "top of the line" job would run to about $120k. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I haven't allowed any cost for labour (and chasing around after who owns >>>> the STC etc). I expect you would get some change (but not much) out of >>>> $10k >>>> >>>> After this expenditure you would still have a 30+ year old airframe. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Regards >>>> >>>> SWK >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Fri 01/10/10 10:06 AM , Dave Donald icans...@y7mail.com sent: >>>> Why would you want a taildragger 150/152 (even though they exist)? If >>>> you get a tricycle 150/152 that nearly every GA pilot trained on, they >>>> are a ready source of tug pilots (when endorsed). And you don't have all >>>> of the issues of ground handling that goes with a taildragger. >>>> >>>> Airframe 20k >>>> Engine 35k >>>> Conversion 15K >>>> = 70k >>>> >>>> Pretty rough figures across a couple of years - the engine may be more >>>> or less depending on condition. Also, most modded 150/152 have a >>>> recurring problem shaking the rivets out of the tailplane skins/spar, >>>> but with proper maintenance this risk is mitigated. >>>> Dave >>>> >>>> >>>> From: Colin Campbell >>>> To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. >>>> Sent: Fri, 1 October, 2010 10:04:54 AM >>>> Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] "Super Motor Falke" and towing >>>> >>>> Can anyone supply information on current cost purchase and conversion of >>>> C 152 to taildragger and 180 hp engine transplant and a LAME who has >>>> done it before? >>>> >>>> Colin C >>>> >>>> On Fri, Oct 1, 2010 at 9:37 AM, Mike Borgelt >>>> <<mailto:mborg...@borgeltinstruments.com>mborg...@borgeltinstruments.com> >>>> wrote: >>>> As proved at Kingaroy over the last 20 years. >>>> >>>> Mike >>>> >>>> >>>> At 09:41 PM 30/09/2010, you wrote: >>>> One has to ask the question - why? >>>> If cost is the answer then a 180HP Cessna 150/152 is the best >>>> alternative. >>>> Tom >>>> >>>> --- On Wed, 29/9/10, Richard Skinner >>>> <<mailto:skinn...@bigpond.net.au>skinn...@bigpond.net.au> wrote: >>>> >>>> From: Richard Skinner >>>> <<mailto:skinn...@bigpond.net.au>skinn...@bigpond.net.au> >>>> Subject: [Aus-soaring] "Super Motor Falke" and towing >>>> To: >>>> <mailto:Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net>Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net >>>> Received: Wednesday, 29 September, 2010, 4:57 PM >>>> >>>> Does anybody out there have any information regarding the launching of >>>> gliders by Motor Falke, or indeed, any other motor glider that may be >>>> used to launch? I̢۪m not aware of it in Australia ia but I understand >>>> that there may be some such happening in Europe? I am aware of Ultra >>>> lights acting as tugs but I̢۪m speciecifically interested in motor >>>> gliders. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Regards >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Richard Skinner >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> <mailto:skinn...@bigpond.net.au>skinn...@bigpond.net.au >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> 08 8431 8249 >>>> >>>> 0419 818 024 >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> If you want to grow old as a pilot, you've got to know >>>> when to push it, and when to back off. Chuck Yeager >>>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Aus-soaring mailing list >> Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net >> To check or change subscription details, visit: >> http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring > > > _______________________________________________ > Aus-soaring mailing list > Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net > To check or change subscription details, visit: > http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring _______________________________________________ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
