Official report from who exactly? On Fri, Oct 31, 2014 at 12:27 AM, Gary Stevenson <gstev...@bigpond.com> wrote:
> Hi Paul, > > As I somewhat earlier said, we should wait for the official report, and > full knowledge of the facts, before trying to draw ANY definitive > conclusions. Given this, I therefore was NOT making any judgement *as > such*, at all. > > Other than that, you are in general perfectly correct, and your further > comments/conclusions are astute and bear thinking about. > > From what Jim choose to tell us, there is a difference between his final > glide and that of the other two pilots who also outlanded close to home. > Jim ended up in a situation where he had nowhere to go. In contrast, the > other 2 pilots safely landed, without incident, in a suitable paddock, and > I think that is the lesson here. They did indeed show greater wisdom. > > Hope that helps to clarify things for you. > > Kindest regards, > > Gary > > BTW let me correct one part my earlier email. *The Specialist* is an > American – not Australian - work written many years ago by Charles Sale. > However the parallels to the Australian experience are unmistakable. > > > > *From:* aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto: > aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] *On Behalf Of *Paul Mander > *Sent:* Thursday, 30 October 2014 1:54 PM > > *To:* 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.' > *Subject:* Re: [Aus-soaring] Bizarre Comp Rules - in the shit > > > > I think you’ve been a bit quick to judge. > > You state that whilst “Jim chose to fly on”, two other pilots made quite > routine outlandings 7km back on the track, implying a greater wisdom on > their part. > > Those outlandings were not routine, if you study the traces. They were > straight in landings just as was Jim’s. One of them makes a desperate last > circle close to the ground then straightens up and lands. > > There is a striking similarity in all three traces, which paint a > cautionary picture. All three picked up climbs just before their last turn, > and then appear to consider themselves on final glide. Then they turn into > a 20kt headwind from the SW, lose their final glide and start to search for > lift. All three try to thermal again without success. > > All three glide on and the ground rises up to smite them; the other two > are simply 7km further out when it does. > > There are undoubtedly lessons to be learnt from their experience, not the > least being how quickly thermals die in Queensland and how quickly the trap > can snap. > > But it’s not instructive, or fair, to make out that one was foolish where > others were wise. > > > > *From:* aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto: > aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] *On Behalf Of *Gary Stevenson > *Sent:* Tuesday, 28 October 2014 10:45 PM > *To:* 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.' > *Subject:* Re: [Aus-soaring] Bizarre Comp Rules - in the shit > > > > Michael Texler in his post of the evening of 28 Oct, finally “Got It”. > > > > Tim has now amplified matters, so that to mis-quote one famous author, > “even a schoolboy can understand”. Just a preamble: the point I* really* > want to make is that on that last day when Jim choose to fly on, 2 pilots > in Sports Class elected to make quite routine outlandings (into the same > paddock apparently), just 7 km from home. As usual their traces are > available on Soaring Spot. Names do not need to be mentioned – just look at > Sports Class, and then check the outlandings and distances covered to > pinpoint the two relevant traces. > > > > Tim , you are being a little bit shy in your use of the Oz vernacular. > The “Municipal Dunny Man” filled a very valuable and quite unique place in > servicing one the essential needs of communities prior to the development > of reticulated sewerage systems. So to get the language straight, let me > put “shed loads” back into its true blue and dinky di context: “shit-cart > full loads”. > > > > Further ; > > For Australian Musical Researchers try Googling “Municipal Dunny Can”. > ..... And of course do not overlook that Australian work of great literary > worth titled “The Specialist”. For visual art buffs this work was no > doubt part inspiration for the 2006 Oz movie “Kenny”. > > > > Cheers, > > Gary > > > > > > *From:* aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [ > mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net > <aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net>] *On Behalf Of *Tim Shirley > *Sent:* Tuesday, 28 October 2014 8:39 PM > *To:* Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. > *Subject:* Re: [Aus-soaring] Bizarre Comp Rules... > > > > Hi all, > > Once again a disclaimer: I hold no relevant official position with the > GFA. I do have considerable experience as a rulemaker, as a Contest > Director, as a Scorer, and as a competition pilot. I speak only for myself. > > What follows is general clarification about competitions and rules, and is > not intended as a comment on any specific incident. > > Back when I was involved in competition rulemaking, I remember we > introduced some principles as a preamble to the rules and on checking I > found that most of them are still there: > > At all times it remains the responsibility of pilots to operate in accorda > nce with the GFA Manual of Standard > > Procedures and all applicable laws and regulations. > > Pilots are expected to conduct themselves at all times in the spirit of t > hese rules and in accordance with the practice of good sportsmanship. > > *Safety is at all times the primary consideration. If at any time a > pilot feels that the requirements of these rules compromises the safety of > their flight then they should take whatever actions are required to ensure > the safety of themselves and of other air users. This may include > withdrawing from the task or from the competition.* > > Pilots are required to conduct themselves in a manner that will not bring > disrepute on the Organisers, the hosting club or the GFA. > > > There is nothing in the competition rules that suspends any laws. There > are no exemptions. Pilots flying in a competition are just pilots, and > must obey every requirement of the law. They remain fully responsible as > Pilots in Command for the conduct of the flight. If they choose to disobey > the law or good practice then that is entirely their responsibility. The > competition is a game. Flying is not. > > No one wants to break their glider or themselves, and the rules of the > game clearly discourage that by the simple fact that most of the time there > is another race tomorrow. You won't get any points from a hospital bed or > if your glider is in bits. On the last day, well if there was a million > dollars at stake I could imagine that the risk of rolling yourself into a > ball might be worth taking for some - but in our game why would anyone > break a $100K glider for a bottle of cheap wine and a round of applause? > Or even for the opportunity to spend shed loads of their own money > representing Australia? > > If you want to know who is responsible for the safety of a flight where > you are the Pilot in Command, take a good look in a mirror. And be very > sure of what you see. > > Cheers > > *Tim Shirley* > > *tra dire é fare c' é mezzo il mare* > > On 28/10/2014 2:06 PM, Texler, Michael wrote: > > The caveat should be in place that the crash was a result of your own poor > decision making. > > > > Now what constitutes poor decision making is a matter of opinion. > > > > Surely competition rules should be in place to discourage crashing: > > i.e. you crash, you are out of the comp. You pack up and go home. > > > > > > I'll leave it to others more experienced in these matters to give reasons why. > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Aus-soaring mailing list > > Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net > > To check or change subscription details, visit: > > http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring > > > > _______________________________________________ > Aus-soaring mailing list > Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net > To check or change subscription details, visit: > http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring >
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