RE: Al-Mahdi/New Book

[Monder M Zbaeda]

Dearest Dr. Fananapazir,

 

I am most grateful for your deepeing into the subject of the Islamic 'Messiah'. These traditions that you share are very interesting indeed. May I ask, if there are any more in relation to the revolution brought by our beloved Imam and the (partial) abrogation of what was?

 

To my knowledge, much of the works compiled by Shi'ah scholars were not ascertaining the authenticity of what was sought, rather, aimed only to compile what they could find. This would place doubt on any tradition relating to 'such' a matter.

 

Your brother in Al-Abha,

Monder

 

Khazeh Fananapazir <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:



Dear Gilberto

As usual [if not more so] I am grateful for your comments below which I reproduce so that the good fragrance of our exchange may remain on these e-pages!

You wrote:

 

 

**We've been through a lot of these issues before. As a Bahai you almost NEED to believe that Islam is useless and old because otherwise there wouldn't have been a NEED for the Bab or Bahaullah. But there are ways to understand all of the above issues properly in a way so that the Shariah makes sense for modern times. A lot of people have an oversimplified notion of what the Shariah requires and how it should be implemented.

 

 

> how can we deal with the law of DHIMMITUDE on the one hand and push

> along interfaith in all its implications?

 

When people talk about "dhimmitude" they may be referring to a whole set of laws which non-Muslim people in Muslim lands were often subject to. The bulk of them were not required by the Quran and sunnah but were imposed by the rulers of that day.

 

In terms of what Islam actually teaches, Ahl al-Kitab (people of previous religions) are supposed to protected by the Muslim state where they would have the right to practice their religion with a great deal of autonomy. They would pay their taxes (jizya) which is a nominal amount of money. In different eras, Muslim rules made the jizya large or small or waived it all together.

 

or how can we take the laws relating to

> killing someone because of "irtidaad" [=apostasy], simply because they

> changed their faith etc etc

 

From what I've read, in the time of the prophet people weren't killed for simple apostasy. But it was for apostasy combined with acts of violence. In the context of an Islamic state with Muslim citizens then converting out of Islam and then committing acts of violence based on that rejection would be treason, which is still a capital offence in the civilized US.

 

…

Peace

 

Gilberto

 

Dear Gilberto

 

You always share such good stuff. One day soon by the grace of God, by the bounty and fuyuuz.aat [grace] of Baha’u’llah I shall even see your face so familiar I am with your electronic pages.

 

THERE IS ONE point that this servant will respond to.

 

You wrote:

***. As a Bahai you almost NEED to believe that Islam is useless and old because otherwise there wouldn't have been a NEED for the Bab or Bahaullah.***

 

The matter I would suggest is something more wonderful and more profound.

 

In the Holy Qur’an there is a verse about **NASKH** 2:106

And for whatever verse We abrogate [=nansakh] or cast into oblivion, We bring a better or the like of it; knowest thou not that God is powerful over everything? 

 

Whatever verses we cancel [=nansakh], or cause thee to forget, we bring a better or its like. Knowest thou not that God hath power over all things? 

 

Whatever verse we shall abrogate [=nansakh], or cause [thee] to forget, we will bring a better than it, or one like unto it. Dost thou not know that God is almighty?

 

*** Ma nansakh min ayatin aw nunsiha na/ti bikhayrin minha aw mithliha alam taAAlam anna Allaha AAala kulli shay-in qadeerun  ***

 

As one can imagine throughout the early Islamic History when the Holy Imams [the descendants of the Imam ‘Ali lived on earth right up to 260 AH] throughout this period people would ask the Imams what this refers to? In other words what would be abrogated?

 

The Holy Imams would give explicit answers that the Promised One would bring a new Book, a New Law

 

These amazingly enthralling hadiths are readable

 

http://al-shia.com/html/ara/books/behar/behar52/a14.html

 

قال لي أبي عليه السلام لابد لنا من آذربيجان لايقوم لها شئ وإذا كان ذلك فكونوا أحلاس بيوتكم وألبدوا ما ألبدنا فاذا تحرك متحركنا فاسعوا إليه ولو حبوا والله لكأني أنظر إليه بين الركن والمقام يبايع الناس على كتاب جديد

 

In fact in this text mention is made of Aadhirbayjan as the locus where this happens. [the exalted Bab’s later Writings and Laws were all in Adhirbaayjan where He was also martyred]

 

This prediction that a new Book will come **Yubaay’u un Naas ‘alaa Kitaabin Jadeedin**

Is found in many sites

 

http://www.ejlasmahdi.com/ejlas2/site/library_f/mm09.htm

 

http://www.shiaweb.org/books/llah_llhaq_2/pa37.html

 

and many more.

 

In the New Testament too there are references to all things being renewed, refreshed…

 

**

Act 3:19  … when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;

 

 

Rev 21:5  And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

 

The essentials are unchangeable [ the most frequent attribute of God in the Holy Qur’an is the attribute of Mercy [Rah.mat]

The most frequent attribute in the Gospels is AGAPE =Love

 

These essentials remain.

 

Bahá'ís do not arrogate a “superiority” to their Faith. Rather they say the “times” require these changes.

 

** It is for this reason, and this reason only, that those who have recognized the Light of God in this age, claim no finality for the Revelation with which they stand identified, nor arrogate to the Faith they have embraced powers and attributes intrinsically superior to, or essentially different from, those which have characterized any of the religious systems that preceded it.**

 

       (Bahái Sacred Texts)

 

My working week has started …so please I say God be with you all.

 

Earlier I wrote:

 

Dearest Gilberto Simpson

Thank you sincerely for paying attention to my humble postings.

You and me we have corresponded many times. I swear by God I wish you great luck in your studies.

 

All i do over many many postings is to suggest that you and i are on the same road spiritually.

 

The essence, the quintessence of the Faith of God is one. So when you say **the many great examples Omid shared with us all done by Muslims**, ** it is of course true in one sense.

What i have grasped all my life and increasingly so as i enter the evening of my life is that the ESSENCE [=the JAWHAR] is one. God [Allah] is the Quintessence of Oneness, Simplicity, Universality. that is why the Holy Book says Qul Huwa Allah u Ah.ad** Say God is Ahad.

the Jawhar [the Quintessence] (bear with me dearest Gilberto) this Essence is One in all the Manifestations of Ah.adiyya [Ipse.ity].

Thus the Jawhar of the Christ is the same as the Jawhar of Muh.ammad.

 

Christ said *Before Abraham was I AM* and Muh.ammad said* I was indeed a Nabi while Man was between water and clay* = kuntu Nabiyyan wa Adam bayna al maa' wat.t.een*

 

one one has fully realized this and indeed all Baha'is aspire day and night in the path of this recognition then what we have are the secondary laws, the Shari'ahs...

In the Shari'ah of Moses you have all the dietary laws:

In the Shari'ah of Jesus St Paul says that women should be silent

 

In the Shari'ah of Muh.ammad [PBUH] we have the law relating to the religious minorities, the law that none can change faith on punishment of death for apostasy, plurality of marriage under certain circumstances, the law of slavery in the Holy Qur'an, etc etc

 

these are all part of the Shari'ah and the Shari'ah are liable to change as aeons and centuries roll by

 

i beg of you once again with all humility, with all sincerity, with all affection to consider the ramifications of the predicates above

 

finally the instructions of 'Abdu'l-Baha

**In accordance with the divine teachings in this glorious dispensation we should not belittle anyone and call him ignorant, saying:  `You know not, but I know'.  Rather, we should look upon others with respect, and when attempting to explain and demonstrate, we should speak as if we are investigating the truth, saying: `Here these things are before us.  Let us investigate to determine where and in what form the truth can be found.'
 (`Abdu'l-Baha:  Selections ...  `Abdu'l-Baha, Page: 30)
**

 

that is all this servant would say:

**`Here these things are before us.  Let us investigate to determine where and in what form the truth can be found.'**

 

how can we deal with the law of DHIMMITUDE on the one hand and push along interfaith in all its implications? or how can we take the laws relating to killing someone because of "irtidaad" [=apostasy], simply because they changed their faith etc etc

 

or how can a woman be silent now

**

1Ti 2:11 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.

1Ti 2:12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.

 

or the harsh circumstance relating to the Canaanite woman? in the New Testament

Mat 15:26 But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it to dogs.

Mat 15:27 And she said, Truth, Lord: yet the dogs eat of the crumbs which fall from their masters' table.

 

so whenever our eyes are focussed on the Jawhar [=the essence] Islam is Christianity is Baha'i is Babi etc

 

but when we look at the 'araz. [=arad.=the contingencies, the accidentals of the Shari'ah] we see divergence and variation.

 

Shoghi Effendi even used absolute as indicating oneness of Jawhar

**the principle, underlying the utterances of Baha'u'llah - utterances that have established for all time the absolute oneness of all the Prophets, Himself included...
 (Bahái Writings)

 

 

 

 

The information contained in this e-mail and any attachments thereto ("e-mail") is sent by the Johnson County Community College ("JCCC") and is intended to be confidential and for the use of only the individual or entity named above. The information may be protected by federal and state privacy and disclosures acts or other legal rules. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are notified that retention, dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error please immediately notify JCCC by email reply and immediately and permanently delete this e-mail message and any attachments thereto. Thank you.

 

 

__________________________________________________

 

You are subscribed to Baha'i Studies as: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Unsubscribe: send a blank email to mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subscribe: send subscribe bahai-st in the message body to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subscribe: http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/all_forums/subscribe?name=bahai-st
Baha'i Studies is available through the following:
Mail - mailto:bahai-st@list.jccc.edu
Web - http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/?forum=bahai-st
News - news://list.jccc.edu/bahai-st
Public - http://www.escribe.com/religion/bahaist
Old Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai-st@list.jccc.net
New Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai-st@list.jccc.edu

---

To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. __________________________________________________ You are subscribed to Baha'i Studies as: mailto:archive@mail-archive.com Unsubscribe: send a blank email to mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe: send subscribe bahai-st in the message body to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe: http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/all_forums/subscribe?name=bahai-st Baha'i Studies is available through the following: Mail - mailto:bahai-st@list.jccc.edu Web - http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/?forum=bahai-st News - news://list.jccc.edu/bahai-st Public - http://www.escribe.com/religion/bahaist Old Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai-st@list.jccc.net New Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai-st@list.jccc.edu