No, you don't understand, Gilberto. ...
On Tue, 24 Jan 2006, Gilberto Simpson wrote:
> On 1/24/06, Iskandar Hai, M.D. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > You keep talking about minor details. I'm talking about foundational
> > issues. Shi`ah believes that Abu-Bakr, `Umar and `Uthman wrongfully
> > usurped `Ali's legitimate position as the Prophet's vicar and authroized
> > interpreter of the Word of God. No Sunni would ever agree to that.
>
> And you don't understand me. I'm not saying Sunnis will turn into
> Shias or that Shias will turn into Sunnis. What I'm saying is that
> both can accept one another as Muslims and disagree without being
> disagreeable.
>
A Shi`ah person does not and cannot, by definition, accept the first three
Caliphs as legitimate successors to the Prophet. And a Sunni will not
accept that `Ali -- and only `Ali -- was the true and legitimate successor
to the Prophet and that `Ali, and `Ali alone, had the Divine right to give
authoritative interpretation of the Word of God.
> > Here is my neck of woods there is a fine Pakistani restaurant, owned by a
> > Shi`ah. The Imam of the Sunni mosque here declared him a kAfir, because he
> > serves alcoholic bevergaes in his restaurant. Owners of other (but Sunni)
> > restaurant businesses who also serve alcoholic beverages have not been
> > publicly condemned. Alcohol is a minor issue here, a ruse, a subterfuge.
>
> I would actually disagree. In alot of inner-city neighborhoods there
> is a problem where immigrant "Muslims" come in and run liquor stores
> in African-American communities. In Oakland recently there was an
> issue where Black Muslims actually vandalized liquor stores owned by
> immigrant Muslims. Similar tensions exist in the Detroit/Dearborn
> area. Immigrant Muslims who run liquor stores are actually really bad
> and hypocritical representatives for Islam and I have no interest in
> defending their behavior in any way except to say that even if they
> are Shia, they are still Muslim... bad Muslims... but Muslims.
>
You disagree with what? You disagree with the Sunni Imam here in my neck
of woods who issued a takfir order against a Shi`ah restaurant owner? This
Imam did not issue a takfir order against Sunni Muslims who did the same.
The issue of alcohol was just a pretext. That's all. Of course serving
alcohol is against Islam. But why did this Sunni Imam decided to
selectively issue a takfir against a Shi`ah resturant owner, and not
against Sunni ones?
> > The foundational issue is the Shi`ah-Sunni conflict on who was the
> > legitimate interpreter of the Quran after the Prophet Muhammad and who was
> > His legitimate successor.
>
> From a Sunni perspective, what you are saying seems silly because
> Sunnis aren't anti-Ali. In your mind this is really contentious but
> from mine it isn't.
>
>From a Shi`ah standpoint, it's quite foundational and not silly at all.
For a Sunni, `Ali was a successor (to `UthmAn) just equal to the other
three Caliphs and he is not regarded by Sunni Muslims as m`asum or
infallible. Shi`ah believes that `Ali, and `Ali alone, was the only
legitimate spiritual as wel as temporal successor to the Prophet and that
`Ali, and `Ali alone, was the Divinely-inspired authorized and infallible
interpreter of the Word of God. The Shi`ah consider the other 3 Caliphs
as usurpers. No Sunni can/will agree to that.
Regards,
Iskandar
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