On Mon, 17 May 2004 21:09:51 -0400, JDG <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > At 06:54 PM 5/13/2004 -0700 Doug Pensinger wrote: > >And are you so sure that some in the U.S. don't have > >motives that are less than honest? Whatever their motives, at this point > >it sure looks like the French (Chineese, Russians, Germans, Canadians etc. > >etc.) had the right idea. > > The right idea:
Let me turn all of these around. > > -military assaults on no less than four of its neighbors Assault of Iran, supported and funded by the US and Saudi Arabia. Assault on Kuwait, only after getting the go-ahead from the US ambassador. Gulf War 1, after the US refused to recognize it's offer to withdraw. Attacks on Kurds pre-Gulf War 1 with no objections by the US. No attacks on Israel but did reward the families of suicide bombers - as did religious groups and members of the royal family in Saudi Arabia. Attacks on Shiites with no intervention by the US after Bush 1 encourage them to revolt. > > -10,000 children dying per month (per UNICEF and WHO) > 10,000 children dying per month due to the embargo on food and medicine imposed on Iraq by the US. > -a near permanent US presence in the Muslim Holy Land outraging Arabs As in the above who are you blaming, Saddam or the US? > > -four years and counting of defiance of UN weapons inspections The UN inspectors were withdrawn after the US said they would likely be harmed if they didn't withdraw. > > -torture of political prisoners See above, the US or Saddam? > > -brutality against Olympic athletes Stretching there. > > -a near-permanent "lukewarm war" with Iraqis shooting at our pilots > After Bush took office an escalation of attacks on all military and quasi-military targets in the non-UN sanctioned no-fly zones with the purpose to roll up all defenses and possibly provoke some response worthy of massive retaliation. > -child prisons Photos not available in the US yet depicts the children and women's wing of Iraqi prisons. > > -funding of international terrorists, particularly in Palestine No known funding of terrorists except for the family survivor money. This in contrast to Saudi funding. > > -no elections, no freedom of speech, religion, assembly, or the press NO elections, last year reports of how Bremer defunded the election preparations. The start of the civil war occurred when the CPA shut down a Shiite newspaper for critical reporting. Prisoners and relatives of prisoners have reported many are in jail because neighbors have made false accusations of being against the CPA. This spring things started to go bad in the north after US troops fired on marches. > > -anti-Semitic propaganda/brainwashing of 38 million Arabs > Criticism of Israel policies not caring how many innocents are killed to hit one possible terrorist now non-existent in most US media. > -genocide of the Marsh Arab culture Revolt encouraged by Bush. Many Shiites believe now to enable Saddam to destroy their culture. > > -the constant threat that Hussein would someday succeed in acquiring either > a ready-made nuclear bomb, or the necessary ingredients of a nuclear bomb US CIA repeatedly informed by reliable sources that nuclear bomb development ended as specified in the Gulf War 1 treaty > > -plundering of oil revenues to build palaces while impoverishing the people As reported at the time with no action taken. > -numerous mass graves US responsible for mass graves of thousands in Gulf War 1. After Gulf War 1, Bush refused to intervene to stop mass killings after encouraging revolts. > > -12+ years of sanctions, lies, broken promises, and failed negotiations You are talking about the U.S. aren't you? > > Oh yes, Doug - France, China, Russia, and Germany had the right idea > allright. Without George Bush, things would have been so much better in > Iraq. Don't you agree.... Absolutely, we would have gotten rid of Saddam with world cooperation or verified that he was not a threat to his neighbors. In fact, we might have done what Cheney suggested in 1998 and ended sanctions and reopened trade so Halliburton could make money without costing US taxpayers $200 billion and what will soon be over a thousand US soldier lives. > > JDG - Who doesn't seriously expect anyone here to have the guts to actually > say that. Surprise, This war was a massive failure, planned in the 90's, entered into illegally, immorally, with patriotic speeches and sleazy back door corrupt deals. It may have permanently damaged the reputation of the US in the rest of the world. It not only clearly demonstrates the corruption of this administration but it's massive incompetence. Saddam was a brutal mass murdering thug supported by the US until some people had better plans for Iraq. I am glad he is gone, but this administration's only sorry excuse now that they are in charge of Iraq is that at least they are not as bad as the worst in the world. FYI, before Bush took office I was considered a moderate and took grief from friends for supporting Gulf War 1. I considered the local Pacifica non-profit station too radical. #1 on Google for liberal news
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