----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert J. Chassell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <brin-l@mccmedia.com> Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2005 11:32 AM Subject: Re: New Pope?
> Dan Minette wrote > > OK, I'll agree that I don't need any faith to state that I don't > like to be hurt. > > ... but I'm stating that there is no factual basis for human > rights. > > This does not make sense. If you don't like to be hurt -- if you > don't like the fact of someone else's `fist in your nose' -- and if > you figure that there are some people more powerful than you, then you > will want `freedom from' their hurtful actions. Sure. But, if you don't have the power to do it, then what practical effect does wishing have? Slaves clearly wanted human rights. They still didn't exist in the Roman Empire and didn't exist for blacks in the US South before 1863-65. > Besides influencing people by talking, it benefits you to establish a > coercive means, a government, to help protect yourself. (You may not > be able to protect yourself; most slave revolts failed. But > factually, slaves did feel hurt and did revolt.) And usually lost. Slave revolts in Rome ended with mass crucifixions to let slaves know that things actually could get worse. > Only if you figure that you are and will be the strongest, or belong > to that group, does it make sense to come out against others' human > rights. Sure. If the Southern slave owners actually acknowledged the basic human rights of their slaves, wouldn't they have to admit they were morally obliged to release them? Wouldn't they lose the economic benefits of having subsistence workers do what they want? I believe in human rights; I'm just arguing that they are not factually based. Someone wanting something doesn't make it a fact. The existence of human rights because people believe in their own rights is no more factual than the existence of God is factual because people believe in God. I believe in both human rights and God, you may believe in the former and not the latter, I don't know. But, I realize that neither are facts. Dan M. _______________________________________________ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
