My parents are older than my peers and less traditional. It has to do with personal choice, not age.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Howard Owens" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "CF-Community" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 9:20 PM Subject: RE: Egypt: Land of the Gods > Frankly, it's by mutual consent. > > We both feel more comfortable in traditional roles. We're not rigid about > it. But I don't think I would be happy in a marriage to a woman who didn't > want to hold primary responsibility for domestic matters. I mean, its fine > if a woman wants to reject that for herself, and it's fine for a guy to > prefer a woman like that, but it's not for me. I think part of it comes > from being raised by parents who were older than the parents of my peers, so > they were more traditional. > > H. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Beth F [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 9:07 AM > To: CF-Community > Subject: Re: Egypt: Land of the Gods > > > H, as long as its her CHOICE to be the domestic one, I have no problem with > it. When its the man's choice it pisses me off. I know some really > independent, professional women who are very domestic at home - its weird to > me (and in the case I am thinking of even weird to her) but if thats what > you like to do, go for it. > > I love to cook and I cook well believe it or not, I just know its not my job > (as a woman) to cook for Mike. That being said I often cook but he cleans > the kitchen and does the dishes. Or we eat out (we are dual income no kids, > why not?). If he cooked I would be starving all the time.....he cooks > pretty badly. > > I do not however do as much cleaning as he does. I feel somewhat guilty > about that but he cares if its clean and I dont'. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Howard Owens" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: "CF-Community" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 5:02 AM > Subject: RE: Egypt: Land of the Gods > > > > I was a bachelor until I was 31, so I know how to cook and clean and sew, > > etc. I don't mind cooking a couple of meals a week (usually on the > > weekends). I enjoy it. But I'm thankful I have a wife who likes (most of > > the time) taking care of the house. I feel especially fortunate that I > > married a woman who cooks as well as my mom. So many of my friends have > > wives who can't cook at all, and they can't cook -- so they eat out a lot, > > or fast food, or frozen meals (though we've been eating a lot more frozen > > meals because during the week I'm so busy and my wife doesn't cook on days > > she has to work (part-time)). > > > > H. > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Michael Corrigan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 5:09 AM > > To: CF-Community > > Subject: Re: Egypt: Land of the Gods > > > > > > In Samoan culture, women are not allowed in the kitchen. It's is the > man's > > domain. He is responsible for gathering and preparing of foods. > > > > I agree wholeheartedly with you Michael. I have a 16 month old and want > to > > create the same environment for him as well. My wife and I do our best to > > create a warm, loving, and safe place for him. He is allowed to push the > > boundaries but we are there to prevent him from doing things that will > hurt > > him. He will learn things that will allow him to be self sufficient when > he > > is older and that includes all of the things that some may consider > feminine > > roles (I.e. cooking, sewing, etc.). My grandmother always told me that a > > man that can't take care of himself is no man and I agree. Whenever I > think > > about how to raise kids, I remember something Mel Gibson (surprisingly) > once > > said that the parents role as disciplinarian should be done in such a > manner > > that it breaks their will but not their > > spirit. I thought that was profound, especially coming from Mad Max! > > > > Michael Corrigan > > Programmer > > Endora Digital Solutions > > 1900 Highland Avenue, Suite 200 > > Lombard, IL 60148 > > 630-627-5055 ext.-136 > > 630/627-5255 Fax > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Michael Dinowitz > > To: CF-Community > > Sent: Thursday, April 04, 2002 9:21 PM > > Subject: Re: Egypt: Land of the Gods > > > > > > As my son does fight with my daughter to give me a book or do something > > for me, I'd say yes, he would. Actually, my son is the sensitive one while > > my daughter is the daredevil. My job as a parent is to give them the > freedom > > to learn and grown and not force them into any specific role. Personally, > I > > think I do a good job with it. > > As a side note, I know how to sew and can also cook rather well. My wife > > learned to cook after we got married. And both of the older children (the > > youngest is to small) enjoy helping me and/or Judith when we cook. > > Personally, I see cooking as a masculine job. It's a knife and fire used > to > > build something. :) > > > > > > > Hm, well maybe it is sexist, depends on your family: - Would your son > > serve > > > you with a small pitcher to wash your hands before you say grace > because > > he > > > loves you and to be helpful? If not, then perhaps your children have > > been > > > raised with different roles based on gender. I am not going to say > its > > > wrong for men and women to play different roles - its all about > personal > > > choice. But I certainly will try my best to raise my kids without > > those > > > kinds of differentiations - both son and daughter will be expected to > > do > > > the same household chores. Girls will be encouraged to do sports and > > boys > > > will be encouraged to do crafts. All children will learn to sew on > > buttons > > > and paddle a kayak. If later in life they choose to take more > > traditional > > > gender roles, thats their choice, but I would like them to be able to > > make > > > that choice and not have it decided by me. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Michael Dinowitz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > To: "CF-Community" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > Sent: Thursday, April 04, 2002 5:59 PM > > > Subject: Re: Egypt: Land of the Gods > > > > > > > > > > Any time. Women's issues are one of the major things held against > > Orthodox > > > Jews and usually they're totally blown out of proportion. > > > > Actually, I was laughing today at something my daughter did. I was > in > > a > > > small fight on a different list with a militant feminist who took > > anything I > > > said as an attack on her. I was laughing thinking how she'd react to > my > > > daughter 'serving' me with a small pitcher to wash my hands before we > > said > > > the grace after meals. She was doing it to be helpful and because she > > loves > > > me but I knew that the woman would see it as me subjugating my > daughter > > or > > > teaching her to be subservient to men. (My daughter is subservient to > no > > one > > > and is more willful than I am). > > > > Have I ever mentioned how proud I am of her and all my kids. :) > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks for the explanation! > > > > > -Ben > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > > > > > Sent: Thursday, April 04, 2002 6:17 PM > > > > > > To: CF-Community > > > > > > Subject: Re: Egypt: Land of the Gods > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > They count, but not in that respect. Again, its a difference > > > > > > in perspective. Men HAVE to pray 3 times a day. Women don't. > > > > > > Men MUST pray with a minyan, Women don't have to. I can go on > > > > > > and on about the whole thing but the point is moot. A woman > > > > > > can't count for a minyan because she's not bound by the > > obligation. > > > > > > An aside, a boy younger than 13 doesn't count either as he's > > > > > > not bound by obligation either. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10 men, called a Minyan. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AFAIK in Orthodox Judiasm, women still don't count > > > > > > > Hope I'm wrong <grin> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -Ben > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > > > > From: BethF [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > > > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 8:56 AM > > > > > > > > To: CF-Community > > > > > > > > Subject: Re: Egypt: Land of the Gods > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I believe (lots of more jewish than me people here to > correct > > > > > > > > me) that jews > > > > > > > > dont' need a synagogue to pray but just 9 "men". > > > > > > > > In fact there is some joke about it my dad used to > tell.....I > > > > > > > > am sure I will > > > > > > > > get it all wrong so I won't tell it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --Beth, Pseudo usenet cop > > > > > > > > Merlin MTB, BikeE AT, RANS gliss, Trek R200, Kickbike > > > > > > > > Owned by Kavik (Samoyed Boy) and Toklat (Keeshond Boy) > > > > > > > > Anchorage, Alaska > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > > > From: "Todd" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > > > > To: "CF-Community" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 4:29 AM > > > > > > > > Subject: Re: Egypt: Land of the Gods > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Did I hear them say that "unlike Jews and Christians" > > > > > > > > Muslims don't need > > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > centralized place to pray? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It seems they also said that uniquely, Muslim's > > > > > > > > > > mosques are more than a place of worship. I can't speak > > > > > > > > for Jews, but > > > > > > > > > > certainly Christians don't believe the only place you > can > > > > > > > > pray is in a > > > > > > > > > > church, nor do they believe that a physical church > > > > > > represents the > > > > > > > > religion > > > > > > > > > > (as was implied). The Body of Christ is where ever there > > > > > > > > are believers. > > > > > > > > > > Also, many churches also serve as education facilities > > > > > > > > and community > > > > > > > > > > facilities, and it's been this way since early in the > > > > > > > > church history. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe they were refering to "going to church"? I don't > > > > > > > > know. I didn't > > > > > > > > > catch that part. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I just got the impression, without really paying as > close > > > > > > > > attention to > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > beginning of that segament as I would like, that they > were > > > > > > > > > mischaracterizing > > > > > > > > > > Christianity (and possibly Judiasim). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > H. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________________________________ Structure your ColdFusion code with Fusebox. Get the official book at http://www.fusionauthority.com/bkinfo.cfm Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/cf-community@houseoffusion.com/ Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/index.cfm?sidebar=lists
