Dear Karl,
As an oceanographic data centre we come across the term 'mean' sea level quite a lot. Common understanding of the generic term is that the averaging interval is any period long enough to remove the tidal signal, typically 1-2 years. This is sufficiently precise for most use cases with the obvious exception of long-term (hundreds of years) studies of sea level variation. For these there are precisely defined sea level averages at fixed points given specific names such as Ordnance Datum Newlyn (averaged from 1915 to 1921) or Malin Ordnance Datum (averaged from 1960 to 1969). Cheers, Roy. Please note that I partially retired on 01/11/2015. I am now only working 7.5 hours a week and can only guarantee e-mail response on Wednesdays, my day in the office. All vocabulary queries should be sent to enquir...@bodc.ac.uk. Please also use this e-mail if your requirement is urgent. ________________________________ From: CF-metadata <cf-metadata-boun...@cgd.ucar.edu> on behalf of Jonathan Gregory <j.m.greg...@reading.ac.uk> Sent: 25 May 2017 17:23 To: cf-metadata@cgd.ucar.edu Subject: Re: [CF-metadata] Standard names for CF trac ticket #143 Dear Karl Yes, it is a bit vague. Mean sea level is a commonly used concept, but if you wanted to be precise you would use standard names referring to geopotential datum or geoid instead, and state which definition was being used in the grid mapping. I think vagueness is OK in standard names if there are datasets which need to use them. Actually my "dozen" was an overestimate because not all of them are talking about regional sea level. The ones affected are air_pressure_at_sea_level:Pa sea_floor_depth_below_sea_level:m sea_surface_height_above_sea_level:m surface_geostrophic_eastward_sea_water_velocity_assuming_sea_level_for_geoid:m s-1 surface_geostrophic_northward_sea_water_velocity_assuming_sea_level_for_geoid:m s-1 surface_geostrophic_sea_water_x_velocity_assuming_sea_level_for_geoid:m s-1 surface_geostrophic_sea_water_y_velocity_assuming_sea_level_for_geoid:m s-1 Best wishes Jonathan ----- Forwarded message from Karl Taylor <taylo...@llnl.gov> ----- > Date: Thu, 25 May 2017 09:05:05 -0700 > From: Karl Taylor <taylo...@llnl.gov> > To: cf-metadata@cgd.ucar.edu > Subject: Re: [CF-metadata] Standard names for CF trac ticket #143 > User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:52.0) > Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.1.1 > > Dear all, > > I kinda like the idea of changing "above sea level" to "above mean > sea level", but it still remains somewhat vague, since the period > over which the mean is computed isn't specified. Or is there some > accepted time? In any case maybe it is o.k. to be vague???? > > best regards, > Karl > > > On 5/25/17 7:02 AM, Jonathan Gregory wrote: > >Dear Alison and Nan > > > >Many thanks for doing this, Alison, and apologies that I didn't have time for > >it sooner myself. I think this is all fine except for the phrase defining > >geopotential datum, which appears in several of them. I would say > > > >The "geopotential datum" is any estimated surface of constant geopotential > >used > >as a datum i.e. a reference level; for the geoid as a datum, specific > >standard > >names are available. > > > >The geoid is a geopotential (equipotential) surface, namely the one which > >encloses (between itself and the solid Earth below) a volume equal to the > >volume of the ocean, often informally described as the surface the ocean > >would > >have if it were at rest. The ellipsoid isn't a geopotential surface. We > >intro- > >duced the term "geopotential datum" in > >https://cf-trac.llnl.gov/trac/ticket/118 > > > >Nan commented > > > >Re: The term 'height_above_sea_level', defined as "Height_above_X" means the > >vertical distance above the named surface X. "sea_level" means *mean* sea > >level, which is close to the geoid in sea areas.' Someone recording observed > >met data on a buoy, looking for the best term for the sensor heights, might > >easily choose this instead of 'height', but the height in that case is above > >actual sea level; varying over time. If this variable is meant to be 'height > >above mean sea level', that should be its name. > > > >There are about a dozen standard names using sea_level to mean mean_sea_level > >consistently, and we don't currently use the phrase mean_sea_level at all. If > >people agree, we could rename the existing standard names as Nan suggests for > >this new one. > > > >Best wishes > > > >Jonathan > > > >----- Forwarded message from alison.pamm...@stfc.ac.uk ----- > > > >>Date: Thu, 18 May 2017 11:37:54 +0000 > >>From: alison.pamm...@stfc.ac.uk > >>To: cf-metadata@cgd.ucar.edu > >>Subject: [CF-metadata] Standard names for CF trac ticket #143 > >> > >>Dear Jonathan, All, > >> > >>CF trac ticket #143 (https://cf-trac.llnl.gov/trac/ticket/143) has been > >>agreed and will be included in CF 1.7. A number of new standard names are > >>needed to support the implementation of this ticket. They are names for > >>constants used in the formula_terms attribute of parameterized vertical > >>coordinates. > >> > >>The following names are proposed. > >> > >>air_pressure_at_top_of_atmosphere_model (Pa) > >>' "Top of atmosphere model" means the upper boundary of the top layer of an > >>atmosphere model.' > >> > >>altitude_at_top_of_atmosphere_model (m) > >>'Altitude is the (geometric) height above the geoid, which is the reference > >>geopotential surface. The geoid is similar to mean sea level. "Top of > >>atmosphere model" means the upper boundary of the top layer of an > >>atmosphere model.' > >> > >>reference_air_pressure_for_atmosphere_vertical_coordinate (Pa) > >>'For models using a dimensionless vertical coordinate, for example, sigma, > >>hybrid sigma-pressure or eta, the values of the vertical coordinate at the > >>model levels are calculated relative to a reference level. "Reference air > >>pressure" is the air pressure at the model reference level. It is a > >>model-dependent constant." > >> > >>height_above_geopotential_datum_at_top_of_atmosphere_model (m) > >>' "Height_above_X" means the vertical distance above the named surface X. > >>The "geopotential datum" is the geopotential reference level (level of zero > >>geopotential) where this is not a specifically named level such as the > >>geoid or a reference ellipsoid. "Top of atmosphere model" means the upper > >>boundary of the top layer of an atmosphere model.' > >> > >>height_above_geopotential_datum (m) > >>'"Height_above_X" means the vertical distance above the named surface X. > >>The "geopotential datum" is the geopotential reference level (level of zero > >>geopotential) where this is not a specifically named level such as the > >>geoid or a reference ellipsoid.' > >> > >>surface_height_above_geopotential_datum (m) > >>' "Height_above_X" means the vertical distance above the named surface X. > >>The surface called "surface" means the lower boundary of the atmosphere. > >>The "geopotential datum" is the geopotential reference level (level of zero > >>geopotential) where this is not a specifically named level such as the > >>geoid or a reference ellipsoid.' > >> > >>sea_surface_height_above_geopotential_datum (m) > >>' "Height_above_X" means the vertical distance above the named surface X. > >>The "geopotential datum" is the geopotential reference level (level of zero > >>geopotential) where this is not a specifically named level such as the > >>geoid or a reference ellipsoid. "Sea surface height" is a time-varying > >>quantity.' > >> > >>sea_floor_depth_below_geopotential_datum (m) > >>' "Depth_below_X" means the vertical distance below the named surface X. > >>The "geopotential datum" is the geopotential reference level (level of zero > >>geopotential) where this is not a specifically named level such as the > >>geoid or a reference ellipsoid.' > >> > >>sea_floor_depth_below_reference_ellipsoid (m) > >>' "Depth_below_X" means the vertical distance below the named surface X. A > >>reference ellipsoid is a regular mathematical figure that approximates the > >>irregular shape of the geoid. A number of reference ellipsoids are defined > >>for use in the field of geodesy.' > >> > >>height_above_sea_level (m) > >>' "Height_above_X" means the vertical distance above the named surface X. > >>"sea_level" means mean sea level, which is close to the geoid in sea areas.' > >> > >>I have based the definitions on my own reading of ticket #143 and on > >>existing names. I'd welcome comments to improve them. > >> > >>Best wishes, > >>Alison > >> > >>------ > >>Alison Pamment Tel: > >>+44 1235 778065 > >>Centre for Environmental Data Analysis Email: > >>alison.pamm...@stfc.ac.uk > >>STFC Rutherford Appleton Laboratory > >>R25, 2.22 > >>Harwell Campus, Didcot, OX11 0QX, U.K. > >> > >> > >> > >>_______________________________________________ > >>CF-metadata mailing list > >>CF-metadata@cgd.ucar.edu > >>http://mailman.cgd.ucar.edu/mailman/listinfo/cf-metadata CF-metadata Info Page - mailman.cgd.ucar.edu Mailing Lists<http://mailman.cgd.ucar.edu/mailman/listinfo/cf-metadata> mailman.cgd.ucar.edu This is an unmoderated list for discussions about interpretation, clarification, and proposals for extensions or change to the CF conventions. > >----- End forwarded message ----- > >_______________________________________________ > >CF-metadata mailing list > >CF-metadata@cgd.ucar.edu > >http://mailman.cgd.ucar.edu/mailman/listinfo/cf-metadata CF-metadata Info Page - mailman.cgd.ucar.edu Mailing Lists<http://mailman.cgd.ucar.edu/mailman/listinfo/cf-metadata> mailman.cgd.ucar.edu This is an unmoderated list for discussions about interpretation, clarification, and proposals for extensions or change to the CF conventions. > > _______________________________________________ > CF-metadata mailing list > CF-metadata@cgd.ucar.edu > http://mailman.cgd.ucar.edu/mailman/listinfo/cf-metadata CF-metadata Info Page - mailman.cgd.ucar.edu Mailing Lists<http://mailman.cgd.ucar.edu/mailman/listinfo/cf-metadata> mailman.cgd.ucar.edu This is an unmoderated list for discussions about interpretation, clarification, and proposals for extensions or change to the CF conventions. ----- End forwarded message ----- _______________________________________________ CF-metadata mailing list CF-metadata@cgd.ucar.edu http://mailman.cgd.ucar.edu/mailman/listinfo/cf-metadata CF-metadata Info Page - mailman.cgd.ucar.edu Mailing Lists<http://mailman.cgd.ucar.edu/mailman/listinfo/cf-metadata> mailman.cgd.ucar.edu This is an unmoderated list for discussions about interpretation, clarification, and proposals for extensions or change to the CF conventions. ________________________________ This message (and any attachments) is for the recipient only. 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