Or just go the Asymmetric route. I went from two sheets and two guys, to one neutral with Twingers, to Asymmetric. Too many strings confuse me.
Bill Coleman On Thu, Dec 1, 2022 at 5:22 PM cenelson--- via CnC-List < cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > Great info and from someone who knows about dip pole or other kite > maneuvers! > > If the after guard, including the trimmers, are paying attention the > appropriate sheets and guys are in their proper places, just displaced from > each other fore and aft as my tactician prefers. > > I am now convinced that the sheets and guys will be in their proper places > after the kite is hoisted and doused as described for port rounding—thus > there is not likely that keeping the guys forward and sheets aft will be > significantly slower than having them paired athwartship. > > Thanks for your reply—it has converted me!! > > Charlie Nelson > Water Phantom > > > > > Sent from the all new AOL app for iOS > <https://apps.apple.com/us/app/aol-news-email-weather-video/id646100661> > > On Thursday, December 1, 2022, 3:34 PM, ALAN BERGEN via CnC-List < > cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > > I have been doing dip pole gybes for forty + years. My primary winches are > forward on the coaming and secondaries are aft (like yours). The primaries > are always used for the guys and the genoa sheets and the secondaries are > always used for the spinnaker sheets. Since you are rounding the windward > mark on starboard tack, the genoa sheet is on the port primary, and the > starboard primary is free to use for the spinnaker guy. When you round the > leeward mark on starboard tack, the port primary is free to use for the > genoa sheet. As soon as you round at either the windward or leeward mark, > the port primary is free if you want to tack or gybe. If you use a > spinnaker staysail, the primary is used for the staysail sheet, after the > genoa is dropped or furled. Try this the next time you're out and you'll > see how simple it is. > > Alan Bergen > 35 Mk III Thirsty > Rose City YC > Portland, OR > > > > On Thu, Dec 1, 2022 at 11:42 AM Charlie Nelson via CnC-List < > cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > > My tactician and I have a friendly disagreement on which winches to use > when doing dip pole jibes with lazy sheets and 'guys' on my masthead rig > C&C 36 XL/kcb: > > On Water Phantom, I have moved the initial primary winches (Lewmar ST 50s) > forward on the cockpit coaming and added another secondary winch pair > (Lewmar ST 44s) at the aft end of the cockpit coaming. Thus my secondaries > are hardly secondary in strength and power ratios, etc. > > All our races have port roundings and most are W-L. Thus we are on > starboard tack at either the windward or leeward mark. I am no expert on > dip-pole jibes but as I thought thru the sequence of events at the turning > mark on starboard tack, it seemed intuitive to me to rig the kite with a > starboard pole always (we never do jib sets!), using the aft secondary > winches for both the sheet and the guy on the kite. This leaves the forward > primary winches committed to the headsail as we make the turn at the mark. > > After the turn, the primary winches can be cleared of the headsail sheets > and the other set of kite lines (sheet and guy) can be rigged on these > primary winches. When it comes time to jibe, the aft secondary kite lines > become lazy and the trimmers use the primary winches--note the primary and > secondary winches are only about 2 feet apart. For the next jibe, the > trimmers move to the aft secondary winches and so on... > > At the leeward mark, always on starboard for port roundings, the kite is > back to being controlled by the aft secondaries (as at the windward > mark) and the forward primaries can be loaded with the headsail sheets in > anticipation of the beat to windward just as they were positioned at the > windward mark. I like this symmetry (but then I am mostly a left-hander!) > and think it involves less line switching, less time and might be faster > than using a forward set of winches for both guys, etc. > > OTOH, my tactician races mainly in a one design Beneteau 41S fleet in > Chicago where the primary forward winches have both guys on them, the aft > secondary winches are used for both sheets always. (I think this is because > the secondaries might be pretty small on the 41S and they and/or the crew > may not be able to handle the guys on the secondary aft winches). > > Since I have no problem with using Lewmar 44s as primary winches, I have > the option to do the winches ala the Chicago way or the Water Phantom way. > Before I commit to having the crew learn how to do these winch swaps as we > go from jibe to jibe, I want to choose the best way to handle the winches > and stick with it through the season. > > What do the list racers think of these alternatives? > > Thanks in advance, > > > Charlie Nelson > Water Phantom > 1995 C&C 36 XL/kcb > New Bern, NC > > > > > Don't forget to show your appreciation and help pay the bills. Make a > contribution at: > > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.paypal.me/stumurray__;!!LIr3w8kk_Xxm!vUPc2BB4BPbQ2KTBeNNg8NMnuKVmashBtlisYX9auO-GBORHm6GeHlV0qLlNN59vn4fVJla0BlJTwUGH0bqT1Hc$ > Thanks for your help. > Alan Bergen > > Don't forget to show your appreciation and help pay the bills. Make a > contribution at: > https://www.paypal.me/stumurray > Thanks for your help. > Charlie Nelson > > Don't forget to show your appreciation and help pay the bills. Make a > contribution at: > https://www.paypal.me/stumurray > Thanks for your help. > Bill Coleman
Don't forget to show your appreciation and help pay the bills. Make a contribution at: https://www.paypal.me/stumurray Thanks for your help.
