I just put up the improved hall of fame page.
I'm using the values Rémi suggests and the values look more in line with
CGOS.
Also, FatMan-1 is fixed at 1800 instead of FatMan and there are links to
the crosstable pages.
* http://cgos.boardspace.net/9x9/hof.html*
I'm not sure how often I will update the page - probably just once per
month right at the beginning of the month.
- Don
Don Dailey wrote:
> To answer several emails in one:
>
> Hideki: One question, why the rating of FatMan-1 is not 1800?
>
> They are probably not identical - if one plays much faster than another, it
> will slightly cripple
> programs that think on the opponents time. That's the only explanation I
> can think of.
>
> Also, I fixed FatMan to 1800, not FatMan-1 because FatMan has more games.
> However, I am going
> to change this to FatMan-1 since it has many more RECENT games. Of course
> on CGOS they are both
> fixed at 1800. This will cause a shift in the entire rating pool of course.
>
> Hideki: And, I'll be happier if there are links to programs on HOF so that I
> Hideki: can see their rating pages.
>
> This is easy - next version will do this.
>
> Rémi: Readpgn games.pgn
> Rémi: elo
> Rémi: advantage 0 ;no advantage for playing White
> Rémi: drawelo 0.01 ;draws are extremely unlikely
> Rémi: mm
> Rémi: exactdist
> Rémi: ratings
>
> I'll switch over to this.
>
> Rémi: No draw at all would be "drawelo 0", but it generates some numerical
> Rémi: problems in the algorithm for computing confidence intervals.
>
> Ahh! I tried to set this to zero and got bizarre results so I left it alone.
> Now I know what to do.
>
>
>
> Rémi: I would be very interested if you could lower your threshold to 197
> Rémi: games, and include december results, which would include Crazy Stone in
> Rémi: the list ;-)
>
> I plan to do this at the end of each month, strictly by month by an automated
> script (it's mostly automated now including a little module to convert the
> results to a pgn format that bayeselo can read. But until I get this fully
> automated I will just include all the games available from now on. I
> think Crazy Stone was at the top before I applied these constraints. I
> want there to be a "price for admission" to get programs to play lots of
> games.
>
> Rémi: Another idea: in order to give more significance to the results, games
> Rémi: between different versions of the same program should be excluded.
> These
> Rémi: games tend to strongly overestimate the strength of the stronger
> version.
>
> There is no way to do this without adding some more infrastructure. It is
> impossible to determine with complete confidence which version is which and
> even if I could, how do I determine which version is the one that should be
> representing the program family? There are simple heuristics that might
> work most of the time but are not completely reliable. The convention I
> once suggested for assigning versions to programs isn't widely followed and
> isn't enforced. The idea was to version your program like this:
> "Lazarus-1-0" where everything before they first hyphen was the generic
> program name and everything after the (first) hyphen is the version number.
> But a malicious user could kick your program off by using your name (with a
> different version number.)
>
> It's possible to enforce this policy by letting the server impose it - your
> password applies to the first characters before the hyphen. Even then, how
> does the server determine which version is representative? When I developed
> Lazarus I added many experimental versions which didn't make the cut but had
> more recent version numbers. I would not want those versions to "carry the
> flag" for the Lazarus family of programs. So the only way to get this
> working right is to add more infrastructure to CGOS.
>
> I think what is better is to provide a way for users to specify that they
> don't want to play their own program. We could consider a "family" of
> programs to be specified by password. OR, it might be reasonable to just
> say that if you don't want your program to play different versions of itself,
> the password must match as well as all characters before the first hyphen.
> So essentially you are forced to version with a hyphen if you want this
> behavior.
>
> Does that sound like a reasonable improvement to the system?
>
>
> Rémi
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Rémi Coulom wrote:
>
>> Don Dailey wrote:
>>
>>> I put up a web page that displays EVERY player who has played at least
>>> 200 games on CGOS.
>>>
>>> It uses the bayeselo program that Rémi authored.
>>>
>>> http://cgos.boardspace.net/9x9/hof.html
>>>
>>>
>>> I'm not sure I used the program correctly - it's rather complicated and
>>> I'm not that great with statistics. If anyone is interested in the
>>> settings I used I can provide that.
>>>
>>> - Don
>>>
>> Another idea: in order to give more significance to the results, games
>> between different versions of the same program should be excluded.
>> These games tend to strongly overestimate the strength of the stronger
>> version.
>>
>> Rémi
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>>
>>
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