There are 25 messages in this issue. Topics in this digest:
1a. Re: Happy CONLANG Day! From: Jörg Rhiemeier 1b. Re: Happy CONLANG Day! From: David J. Peterson 1c. Re: Happy CONLANG Day! From: Jörg Rhiemeier 1d. Re: Happy CONLANG Day! From: John Vertical 1e. Re: Happy CONLANG Day! From: Amanda Babcock Furrow 1f. Re: Happy CONLANG Day! From: And Rosta 1g. Re: Happy CONLANG Day! From: Benct Philip Jonsson 1h. Re: Happy CONLANG Day! From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2a. Re: Scots. From: Tristan McLeay 2b. Re: Scots. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2c. Re: Scots. From: Rebecca Bettencourt 2d. Re: Scots. From: ROGER MILLS 2e. Re: Scots. From: Eric Christopherson 2f. Re: Scots. From: J. 'Mach' Wust 2g. Re: Scots. From: Benct Philip Jonsson 2h. Re: Scots. From: taliesin the storyteller 3a. Re: OT: Gruess (was Comma gets a cure -- in German?) From: J. 'Mach' Wust 3b. Re: OT: Gruess (was Comma gets a cure -- in German?) From: Mark J. Reed 3c. Re: OT: Gruess (was Comma gets a cure -- in German?) From: J. 'Mach' Wust 3d. Re: OT: Gruess (was Comma gets a cure -- in German?) From: Benct Philip Jonsson 4a. Featherstone From: Mark J. Reed 4b. Re: Featherstone From: Michael Poxon 4c. Re: Featherstone From: Lars Finsen 4d. Re: Featherstone From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4e. Re: Featherstone From: Mark J. Reed Messages ________________________________________________________________________ 1a. Re: Happy CONLANG Day! Posted by: "Jörg Rhiemeier" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Fri Jul 18, 2008 12:56 pm ((PDT)) Hallo! On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 15:17:14 -0400, Mark J. Reed wrote: > So the list went live on July 18, 1991? Yes, according to a post John Cowan made seven years ago: http://listserv.brown.edu/archives/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind0106c&L=conlang&T=0&F=&S=&P=16564 It was a different server back then, though, and apparently, an informal network of people exchanging e-mails about conlangs and conlanging existed at least for several weeks before that. ... brought to you by the Weeping Elf Messages in this topic (10) ________________________________________________________________________ 1b. Re: Happy CONLANG Day! Posted by: "David J. Peterson" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Fri Jul 18, 2008 1:27 pm ((PDT)) Jörg: << It was a different server back then, though, and apparently, an informal network of people exchanging e-mails about conlangs and conlanging existed at least for several weeks before that. >> That would seem to be the case. In that message, Ronald writes: << Glad to see the mailing list is working. >> Rather presumptuous unless he saw that it was already working (i.e., there was at least one post before his). Regarding the content, I'm not sure if Pale Fire was a commentary on Esperanto, but I bet the idea of creating the Zemblan language (and the mania associated with such an inventor) might have been inspired by the IAL movement. Zemblan itself, of course, doesn't look like an IAL at all. In fact, with what words we see, it's a rather plausible hypothetical member of the Slavic language family--at least from what I remember. I should give it another read. I wonder if anyone's posted a wordlist online... Well, unless I'm missing something, there isn't. I'm rather surprised, because it shouldn't be that difficult to go through the book and note each Zemblan word, and then to put it on a webpage somewhere. There aren't many words, and the book and author are rather popular. -David ******************************************************************* "A male love inevivi i'ala'i oku i ue pokulu'ume o heki a." "No eternal reward will forgive us now for wasting the dawn." -Jim Morrison http://dedalvs.free.fr/ Messages in this topic (10) ________________________________________________________________________ 1c. Re: Happy CONLANG Day! Posted by: "Jörg Rhiemeier" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Fri Jul 18, 2008 2:12 pm ((PDT)) Hallo! On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 13:27:36 -0700, David J. Peterson wrote: > Jörg: > << > It was a different server back then, though, and apparently, > an informal network of people exchanging e-mails about > conlangs and conlanging existed at least for several weeks > before that. > >> > > That would seem to be the case. In that message, Ronald writes: > > << > Glad to see the mailing list is working. > >> > > Rather presumptuous unless he saw that it was already > working (i.e., there was at least one post before his). Yes, there must have been some signs of life from the list; presumably a few successfully delivered test messages. > Regarding the content, I'm not sure if Pale Fire was a commentary > on Esperanto, but I bet the idea of creating the Zemblan language > (and the mania associated with such an inventor) might have > been inspired by the IAL movement. Zemblan itself, of course, > doesn't look like an IAL at all. In fact, with what words we see, > it's a rather plausible hypothetical member of the Slavic language > family--at least from what I remember. I should give it another > read. I wonder if anyone's posted a wordlist online... I haven't read the book yet, but judging from what I have read *about* it, Zemblan is not an IAL. It is, apparently, the language of a fictional country in northeastern Europe (which way a Slavic language would make sense), and it appears to be somewhat unclear whether it is a real country within the narrative of the book or fictional even within it. > Well, unless I'm missing something, there isn't. I'm rather > surprised, because it shouldn't be that difficult to go through > the book and note each Zemblan word, and then to put it on > a webpage somewhere. There aren't many words, and the > book and author are rather popular. I haven't found anything either. There is a web site named "Zemblan Grammar", but it is a blog that doesn't seem to have much to do with the language; it is just that, apparently after reading _Pale Fire_, the author thought that "Zemblan Grammar" would be a nice fanciful title for his blog. ... brought to you by the Weeping Elf Messages in this topic (10) ________________________________________________________________________ 1d. Re: Happy CONLANG Day! Posted by: "John Vertical" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Fri Jul 18, 2008 3:53 pm ((PDT)) On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 13:27:36 -0700, David J. Peterson wrote: >Jörg: ><< >It was a different server back then, though, and apparently, >an informal network of people exchanging e-mails about >conlangs and conlanging existed at least for several weeks >before that. > >> > >That would seem to be the case. In that message, Ronald writes: also: >>>By 16 July the list had grown to the 48 following persons(...) >>>I think that And and I are the only survivors from that era. Has there been a gradual de-lurking over the recent years then? I can recognize at least half a dozen names in the list, and I've only been here for three years now (and even that feels like less ) John Vertical Messages in this topic (10) ________________________________________________________________________ 1e. Re: Happy CONLANG Day! Posted by: "Amanda Babcock Furrow" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sat Jul 19, 2008 6:45 am ((PDT)) On Fri, Jul 18, 2008 at 06:53:01PM -0400, John Vertical wrote: > >>>By 16 July the list had grown to the 48 following persons(...) > >>>I think that And and I are the only survivors from that era. > > Has there been a gradual de-lurking over the recent years then? I can > recognize at least half a dozen names in the list, and I've only been here > for three years now (and even that feels like less ) I was surprised and tickled to see my name among those 48 (as Amanda Lynn Babcock). In my case, I might very well be subscribed but not posting when this message came out. tylakèhlpë'fö, Amanda Messages in this topic (10) ________________________________________________________________________ 1f. Re: Happy CONLANG Day! Posted by: "And Rosta" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sat Jul 19, 2008 7:15 am ((PDT)) John Vertical, On 18/07/2008 23:53: > On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 13:27:36 -0700, David J. Peterson wrote: >> Jörg: >> << >> It was a different server back then, though, and apparently, >> an informal network of people exchanging e-mails about >> conlangs and conlanging existed at least for several weeks >> before that. >> That would seem to be the case. In that message, Ronald writes: > > also: >>>> By 16 July the list had grown to the 48 following persons(...) >>>> I think that And and I are the only survivors from that era. > > Has there been a gradual de-lurking over the recent years then? I can > recognize at least half a dozen names in the list, and I've only been here > for three years now (and even that feels like less ) I don't see as many as half a dozen of those names still appearing on Conlang. Rick Harrison periodically leaves his lone furrow to post on Conlang. Amanda Babcock has always been here, I think, though she must have been a babe in arms 17 years ago, seeing as she's still a stripling nowadays. Richard Kennaway popped up this time a year ago, because he was doing an encyclopaedia article on conlangs. Steve Rice contributes to Auxlang, I believe. Some of those names are of course very august and justly renowned: Rick Morneau, author of one of the foremost treatises on conlanging (his "Lexical Semantics"); John Cowan, author of the Complete Lojban Language; and Nick Nicholas, translator of the Klingon Hamlet. --And. Messages in this topic (10) ________________________________________________________________________ 1g. Re: Happy CONLANG Day! Posted by: "Benct Philip Jonsson" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sat Jul 19, 2008 7:28 am ((PDT)) On 2008-07-19 And Rosta wrote: > Rick Morneau, author of one of the foremost treatises on conlanging > (his "Lexical Semantics") Which can stil be fûnd at <http://www.eskimo.com/~ram/lexical_semantics.html> and iz stil a damd gôd réd! /BéPé Messages in this topic (10) ________________________________________________________________________ 1h. Re: Happy CONLANG Day! Posted by: "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sat Jul 19, 2008 7:56 am ((PDT)) > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of And Rosta > I don't see as many as half a dozen of those names still > appearing on Conlang. Rick Harrison periodically leaves his > lone furrow to post on Conlang. Amanda Babcock has always > been here, I think, though she must have been a babe in arms > 17 years ago, seeing as she's still a stripling nowadays. > Richard Kennaway popped up this time a year ago, because he > was doing an encyclopaedia article on conlangs. Steve Rice > contributes to Auxlang, I believe. I haven't been here but a few years, but it's good to see that interest in this subject is hanging on. Yes, Steve Rice is still very active on Auxlang. I have no idea if he lurks here or not. Messages in this topic (10) ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ 2a. Re: Scots. Posted by: "Tristan McLeay" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Fri Jul 18, 2008 5:09 pm ((PDT)) On 19.07.2008 01:58:21, Lars Finsen wrote: > A word sounding like /s3:r/ or similar is common in Scottish songs, > and seems to be an emphasising adjective. I wonder if any of our > knowledgeable listmembers could identify it for me? > > It's such a struggle to identify a vowel from those IPA or Sampa > lists. I guess you need years of training to do it passably. > > BTW, Scots seems to have escaped the diphthongisation that tore > gashes and slashes through the English vowels some time during the > last centuries. I do hear diphthongs, but it seems to be largely the > traditional Indoeuropean ones. I'm not sure what you mean by traditional Indo-European diphthongs. If you're saying that Scots diphthongs mostly decend from the common ones, then that's not true at all. PIE has the diphthongs *ai, *au, *ei, *eu, *oi and *ou. As with the simple short vowels, o > a in diphthongs and *ei had, I believe, merged with *i: already by Common Germanic (or if not then, then definitely before English was English), so Proto- Germanic has *ai, *au, *eu. Now, by Old English, *ai -> a: which in English rounded but in Scots --- the separate language, not Scottish English --- remained unrounded. *au had become a diphthong spelt "ea" and pronounced something like [&A] or [&@] --- no doubt very similar, in fact, to the Australian diphthong /&O/ corresponding to RP /aU/. In Middle English, this vowel (still spelt "ea") had merged with *æ: as the monophthong /E:/. In Modern English of course it's mostly become /i:/ thanks to the Great Vowel Shift but I think in Scots a greater proportion remain at the more expected /e:/. And as for *eu, it had become "eo" which in turn merged with /e:/ (spelt "ee") in Middle English and has almost entirely become Modern English/Scots /i:/. So as you can see no Indo-European diphthongs remain in English or Scots, the last having been lost around a millenium ago. If you mean that Scots/Scottish diphthongs are merely more like what you see in other Indo-European languages than the English ones are, then well maybe I'm just thinking too hard, but I don't know any diphthongs are particularly I.-E., and even the diphthongs RP or American English has that Scots/Scottish lacks, like /eI/ have certainly existed in in the last thousand years in French, Spanish and German. I guess the RP /@U/ diphthong's a little odd. (Of course, if you're using Australian English as your baseline, then well yeah its diphthongs are a little funny, with about a million going towards some nature of high front vowel contrasted with a single one going from a low front vowel to a low back vowel. But I'm probably the only person on this list who'd even think of doing that.) On 19.07.2008 03:54:32 Mark J. Reed wrote: > On Fri, Jul 18, 2008 at 1:19 PM, Paul Bennett > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Is it the mostly-archaic English word 'sore', meaning 'very' (cogn. > > Ger. 'sehr', i.a.)? > > I wouldn't say it's mostly archaic. The word is of course common in > the sense of "painful", but even the "very" meaning is alive and well > in many rural areas in the US. ("I'm sore tempted to hit you upside > your head right now") I for my part have never once heard it meaning "very", and if I'd heard it I would've assumed it was just a nonce or highly regional and slangy use of an emotional term as an emphatic. -- Tristan. Messages in this topic (11) ________________________________________________________________________ 2b. Re: Scots. Posted by: "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Fri Jul 18, 2008 5:43 pm ((PDT)) > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tristan McLeay > On 19.07.2008 03:54:32 Mark J. Reed wrote: > > On Fri, Jul 18, 2008 at 1:19 PM, Paul Bennett > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > Is it the mostly-archaic English word 'sore', meaning > 'very' (cogn. > > > Ger. 'sehr', i.a.)? > > > > I wouldn't say it's mostly archaic. The word is of course common in > > the sense of "painful", but even the "very" meaning is alive and well > > in many rural areas in the US. ("I'm sore tempted to hit you upside > > your head right now") > > I for my part have never once heard it meaning "very", and if I'd heard > it I would've assumed it was just a nonce or highly regional and slangy > use of an emotional term as an emphatic. I'm not a Southerner but have lived here for over 8 years now. There are some very interesting usages around, but I've never heard that one. Messages in this topic (11) ________________________________________________________________________ 2c. Re: Scots. Posted by: "Rebecca Bettencourt" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Fri Jul 18, 2008 5:46 pm ((PDT)) On Fri, Jul 18, 2008 at 10:54 AM, Mark J. Reed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Fri, Jul 18, 2008 at 1:19 PM, Paul Bennett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Is it the mostly-archaic English word 'sore', meaning 'very' (cogn. >> Ger. 'sehr', i.a.)? > > I wouldn't say it's mostly archaic. The word is of course common in > the sense of "painful", but even the "very" meaning is alive and well > in many rural areas in the US. ("I'm sore tempted to hit you upside > your head right now") "so sorely needed" is quite a common phrase, even outside rural areas. -- Hasta la pasta, Rebecca Bettencourt. ------------------------------------------------------------ I tried the real world once; didn't really care for it. "I could counter with the fact that a disproportionate number of TG women I know are computer programmers. ::grin:: In fact, there's a joke going around that says exposure to computer screens causes transsexuality." -- Kate Bornstein Messages in this topic (11) ________________________________________________________________________ 2d. Re: Scots. Posted by: "ROGER MILLS" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Fri Jul 18, 2008 8:52 pm ((PDT)) Eldin Raigmore wrote: > >It sounds like it's used where some older English (such as King James's >Bible >English) used "sore"; and where German uses "sehr" (and seems to be >pronounced a lot like German's "sehr".) Yes, sounds reasonable. In the KJV certainly-- In Luke's story of the Nativity, the shepherds are "sore afraid". "Sore afflicted" also occurs (Psalms?? or maybe in the Anglican Book of Common Prayer). I'm sure I've said on occasion "I'm sorely tempted to....." and "XXX is sorely needed", but never without the -ly ending. Messages in this topic (11) ________________________________________________________________________ 2e. Re: Scots. Posted by: "Eric Christopherson" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Fri Jul 18, 2008 11:26 pm ((PDT)) On Jul 18, 2008, at 10:51 PM, ROGER MILLS wrote: > Eldin Raigmore wrote: >> >> It sounds like it's used where some older English (such as King >> James's Bible >> English) used "sore"; and where German uses "sehr" (and seems to be >> pronounced a lot like German's "sehr".) > > Yes, sounds reasonable. In the KJV certainly-- In Luke's story of > the Nativity, the shepherds are "sore afraid". "Sore afflicted" > also occurs (Psalms?? or maybe in the Anglican Book of Common > Prayer). I'm sure I've said on occasion "I'm sorely tempted > to....." and "XXX is sorely needed", but never without the -ly ending. Is the word <sore(ly)> meaning "very" the same word as the word <sore> having to do with pain? I've always perceived it to be -- since the kinds of adjectives normally used for <sore> are ones where you can easily imagine a semantic shift from "so much that one feels pain" to just "much" -- but now that I hear that it's related to German <sehr> I wonder. Does/did <sehr> (or related words) also have shades of meaning having to do with pain? Messages in this topic (11) ________________________________________________________________________ 2f. Re: Scots. Posted by: "J. 'Mach' Wust" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sat Jul 19, 2008 3:13 am ((PDT)) On Sat, 19 Jul 2008 01:25:47 -0500, Eric Christopherson wrote: >Is the word <sore(ly)> meaning "very" the same word as the word ><sore> having to do with pain? I've always perceived it to be -- >since the kinds of adjectives normally used for <sore> are ones where >you can easily imagine a semantic shift from "so much that one feels >pain" to just "much" -- but now that I hear that it's related to >German <sehr> I wonder. Does/did <sehr> (or related words) also have >shades of meaning having to do with pain? It is conservated mostly in the word "unversehrt" 'unscathed', which is from a rather outdated verb "versehren" 'injure'. Some dialects are said to retain the word "sehr" as an adjective with the same meaning as in English. See also: http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=sore -- grüess mach Messages in this topic (11) ________________________________________________________________________ 2g. Re: Scots. Posted by: "Benct Philip Jonsson" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sat Jul 19, 2008 7:15 am ((PDT)) J. 'Mach' Wust skrev: > On Sat, 19 Jul 2008 01:25:47 -0500, Eric Christopherson wrote: > >> Is the word <sore(ly)> meaning "very" the same >> word as the word <sore> having to do with pain? >> I've always perceived it to be -- since the >> kinds of adjectives normally used for <sore> >> are ones where you can easily imagine a >> semantic shift from "so much that one feels >> pain" to just "much" -- but now that I hear >> that it's related to German <sehr> I wonder. >> Does/did <sehr> (or related words) also have >> shades of meaning having to do with pain? > > It is conservated mostly in the word > "unversehrt" 'unscathed', which is from a rather > outdated verb "versehren" 'injure'. Some > dialects are said to retain the word "sehr" as > an adjective with the same meaning as in > English. See also: > http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=sore That link just saved me from a lot of type-copying out of Skeat! Thanks! As it happens Icelandic preserves _sár_ as both a noun and an adjective but not the verb, while Swedish has only the noun _sår_ (the normal word for 'wound') and the verb _såra_ 'injure, hurt'. I don't know about Danish (Lars_1) or Norwegian (Lars_2, Kaliessin?) /BP 8^)> -- Benct Philip Jonsson -- melroch atte melroch dotte se ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "C'est en vain que nos Josués littéraires crient à la langue de s'arrêter; les langues ni le soleil ne s'arrêtent plus. Le jour où elles se *fixent*, c'est qu'elles meurent." (Victor Hugo) Messages in this topic (11) ________________________________________________________________________ 2h. Re: Scots. Posted by: "taliesin the storyteller" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sat Jul 19, 2008 8:06 am ((PDT)) * Benct Philip Jonsson said on 2008-07-19 16:15:08 +0200 > J. 'Mach' Wust skrev: > > On Sat, 19 Jul 2008 01:25:47 -0500, Eric Christopherson > wrote: > > > >> Is the word <sore(ly)> meaning "very" the same > >> word as the word <sore> having to do with pain? > > As it happens Icelandic preserves _sár_ as both a > noun and an adjective but not the verb, while > Swedish has only the noun _sår_ (the normal word > for 'wound') and the verb _såra_ 'injure, hurt'. > I don't know about Danish (Lars_1) or Norwegian > (Lars_2, Kaliessin?) å såre = to wound, hurt sår = a wound sårt = slightly painful, tender, but I think mostly used for mental pain "et sårt brudd" = a painful breakup (of a relationship) "et sårt minne" = a painful/dear memory There's also (don't know if it is from the same word): særs = especially, can be used as "very" særlig = especially, can be used as "very" sært = strange, weird, unusual "særs idiotisk", "veldig idiotisk" = especially/very idiotic t. Messages in this topic (11) ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ 3a. Re: OT: Gruess (was Comma gets a cure -- in German?) Posted by: "J. 'Mach' Wust" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sat Jul 19, 2008 3:02 am ((PDT)) On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 19:33:43 +0100, Peter Collier wrote: >I think its the Alemannic diphthong /y@)/, rather than standard German /y/ - >like the Schwyzertüütsch greeting "Grüess di". Use of ss instead of ß >points to Swiss usage too. > >I'm guessing though - was I right? As Benct already confirmed, that's right. The pronunciation would be something like [ɡ̊ryə̯sː], that is, [EMAIL PROTECTED]:]. The apokope of the plural "-e" also points to Swiss German, compare standard German "Grüsse" 'greetings' -- [EMAIL PROTECTED]: mach Messages in this topic (14) ________________________________________________________________________ 3b. Re: OT: Gruess (was Comma gets a cure -- in German?) Posted by: "Mark J. Reed" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sat Jul 19, 2008 5:05 am ((PDT)) So the diphthong can also be written "uee"? Messages in this topic (14) ________________________________________________________________________ 3c. Re: OT: Gruess (was Comma gets a cure -- in German?) Posted by: "J. 'Mach' Wust" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sat Jul 19, 2008 5:27 am ((PDT)) On Sat, 19 Jul 2008 08:05:25 -0400, Mark J. Reed wrote: >So the diphthong can also be written "uee"? I really wouldn't do that. I've heard it is done in the military where they haven't learnt yet how to type diacritics, that is, if you happen to bear one of the rare family names with |üe| such as "Nüesch" or "Rüegger". -- grüess mach Messages in this topic (14) ________________________________________________________________________ 3d. Re: OT: Gruess (was Comma gets a cure -- in German?) Posted by: "Benct Philip Jonsson" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sat Jul 19, 2008 6:39 am ((PDT)) J. 'Mach' Wust skrev: > On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 19:33:43 +0100, Peter Collier wrote: > >> I think its the Alemannic diphthong /y@)/, rather than standard German /y/ - >> like the Schwyzertüütsch greeting "Grüess di". Use of ss instead of ß >> points to Swiss usage too. >> >> I'm guessing though - was I right? > > As Benct already confirmed, that's right. The pronunciation would be > something like [ɡ̊ryə̯sː], that is, [EMAIL > PROTECTED]:]. The apokope of the plural > "-e" also points to Swiss German, compare standard German "Grüsse" 'greetings' > > -- > [EMAIL PROTECTED]: > mach BTW, do you happen to know if it is Standard German which has monophthongized _üe_ or Allemannic which has diphthongized _üü_ in this particular word? IIANM both things have occurred. /BP Messages in this topic (14) ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ 4a. Featherstone Posted by: "Mark J. Reed" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sat Jul 19, 2008 5:49 am ((PDT)) Am I right in assuming that even though "Featherstonehaugh" is pronounced ~ /'fEn.SO:/, the simpler name "Featherstone" is in fact pronounced as it is spelled, like "feather"+"stone" (=~ /'fED.R=.ston/ for various values of /R=/ ranging from /@/ to /@r\/ to /@r\=/, etc)? Or perhaps with a reduced final vowel (-/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/)? -- Sent from Gmail for mobile | mobile.google.com Mark J. Reed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Messages in this topic (5) ________________________________________________________________________ 4b. Re: Featherstone Posted by: "Michael Poxon" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sat Jul 19, 2008 6:46 am ((PDT)) only /E/ in very old-fashioned RP! The usual pronunciation of the first syllable is the same as the word 'fan'. Mike > Am I right in assuming that even though "Featherstonehaugh" is > pronounced ~ /'fEn.SO:/, Messages in this topic (5) ________________________________________________________________________ 4c. Re: Featherstone Posted by: "Lars Finsen" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sat Jul 19, 2008 7:19 am ((PDT)) Den 19. jul. 2008 kl. 14.44 skreiv Mark J. Reed: > Am I right in assuming that even though "Featherstonehaugh" is > pronounced ~ /'fEn.SO:/, the simpler name "Featherstone" is in fact > pronounced as it is spelled, like "feather"+"stone" (=~ /'fED.R=.ston/ > for various values of /R=/ ranging from /@/ to /@r\/ to /@r\=/, etc)? "(=~"? Is that a standard symbol in some symbolic system, or what? LEF Messages in this topic (5) ________________________________________________________________________ 4d. Re: Featherstone Posted by: "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sat Jul 19, 2008 7:59 am ((PDT)) > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lars Finsen > "(=~"? Is that a standard symbol in some symbolic system, or what? I've never seen it before, but my intuitive sense leads me to read it as "approximately equal to". I generally just use "~" alone for that, but this may be better so we don't confuse it with X-SAMPA "~" for nasalization. Messages in this topic (5) ________________________________________________________________________ 4e. Re: Featherstone Posted by: "Mark J. Reed" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sat Jul 19, 2008 8:03 am ((PDT)) On Sat, Jul 19, 2008 at 10:55 AM, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lars Finsen > >> "(=~"? Is that a standard symbol in some symbolic system, or > what? The "(" is just opening a parenthetical. The "=~" is meant to be "equals approximately". Which would perhaps have been better rendered as just "~", but I mentally read that as just "approximately". -- Mark J. Reed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Messages in this topic (5) ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/conlang/ <*> Your email settings: Digest Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/conlang/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------