Yeah, I hear you...but the cow joke doesn't work if you call it a balance and square through. :-)
On Sat, Aug 9, 2025, 7:28 PM Joe Harrington via Contra Callers < [email protected]> wrote: > In a 6 count square through 2 without a balance, I don't think the > pull-bys are happening on beats 2-3/5-6, nor on 1-2/4-5, with one beat to > set up or turn. They are either happening on 1-2-3-4 or 3-4-5-6, at least > when danced by experienced dancers who care about the music and can do the > move in time. Could it be that someone saw the chaos of different people > doing it on different beats and said, let's set this up with a balance and > then do the move together, in the same four beats, since it's more > interesting with the balance anyway? > > Does that square (sorry) with history? > > When did this move come into contra? Could that someone have been Tony > Parkes, or is the move with the balance older than Friday Night Fever? > > As for what to call it, I'd be slow to make changes. I see some technical > value in searching databases for the balance/square-through combination > separately from non-balance square-throughs, but in cueing, I find "balance > and square through two" to be quicker and clearer than either "interrupted" > or "balanced". > > Thanks to Mac Mckeever for a relevant offline message. > > --jh-- > > > > On Sat, Aug 9, 2025 at 7:54 PM Jerome Grisanti <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> I use the move (balance, square thru two, repeat), but don't use the term >> balanced or interrupted (though I understand both in written instructions). >> To dancers, I just orient with whom they will be doing it and say balance, >> pull by (this person), pull by (that person). I call it a "square thru." I >> understand that MWSD does not typically use balances in square thrus, so if >> MWSD dancers are present I might explain the addition as a habit among >> contra dancers. With contra dancers I might similarly explain when I use a >> no-balance version of square thru. >> >> >> —Jerome Grisanti >> >> >> Jerome Grisanti >> 660-528-0858 >> http://www.jeromegrisanti.com >> >> "Whatever you do, or dream you can, begin it. Boldness has genius and >> power and magic in it." --Johann Wolfgang von Goethe >> >> On Sat, Aug 9, 2025, 6:00 PM Chris Page via Contra Callers < >> [email protected]> wrote: >> >>> It's because with the balance and square through, a little time is >>> stolen from the balances. >>> It also feels like a rushed figure, but there's recovery points. >>> >>> My best (rough) estimate for the timing of a square through is 2 beats >>> per pull by >>> and 1 beat per 90 degree turn. >>> >>> Tony Parkes original version of Friday Night Fever, with only one >>> balance, takes >>> the same timing approach. I'm not sure when two balances got added to >>> square throughs. Maybe "Al's Advice"? >>> >>> Cheers, >>> -Chris Page >>> Los Angeles, CA >>> >>> On Sat, Aug 9, 2025 at 1:42 PM Joe Harrington via Contra Callers >>> <[email protected]> wrote: >>> > >>> > Oddly, in several dances with uninterrupted square through twos and >>> threes in Caller's Box, the figure is given an extra two beats. What's >>> with that? See: >>> > >>> > The Amazing Sarah Wilcox by Tom Hinds >>> > https://www.ibiblio.org/contradance/thecallersbox/dance.php?id=6397 >>> > >>> > 0.0238095238 or 1/42 by Gary Shapiro >>> > https://www.ibiblio.org/contradance/thecallersbox/dance.php?id=12155 >>> > >>> > Square Route by Bob Isaacs and Chris Page >>> > https://www.ibiblio.org/contradance/thecallersbox/dance.php?id=13707 >>> > >>> > --jh-- >>> > >>> > >>> > On Sat, Aug 9, 2025 at 3:52 PM Bob Hofkin via Contra Callers < >>> [email protected]> wrote: >>> >> >>> >> I pulled Contra*Butions 3 off my shelf, and found the term "balanced >>> >> square thru" (along with a definition). I'm sure Chris and Michael >>> have >>> >> good reason for standardizing on "interrupted" and I'm not about to >>> >> challenge them. >>> >> >>> >> Bob >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> On 08/09/2025 12:13, Bob Morgan via Contra Callers wrote: >>> >> > Caller's Box only references interrupted square through >>> >> > >>> >> > Carol Ormand's Baling Hay does contain an interrupted square thru 2 >>> >> > >>> >> > https://www.ibiblio.org/contradance/thecallersbox/dance.php?id=1522 >>> >> > < >>> https://www.ibiblio.org/contradance/thecallersbox/dance.php?id=1522> >>> >> > >>> >> > I don't think I've come across balanced square through all that much >>> >> > here. I would define either usage in teaching though. >>> >> > >>> >> > Bob >>> >> > >>> >> > On Sat, Aug 9, 2025 at 7:38 PM John Sweeney via Contra Callers >>> >> > <[email protected] >>> >> > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>> >> > >>> >> > The original “Rights & Lefts” was commonly four steps for each >>> of >>> >> > four “changes”.____ >>> >> > >>> >> > __ __ >>> >> > >>> >> > Square Dancers often do them at twice that speed, just two >>> steps for >>> >> > each change.____ >>> >> > >>> >> > __ __ >>> >> > >>> >> > My guess is that Contra Dancers found four steps too slow and >>> wanted >>> >> > to add more energy, so they introduced the Balance Forward & >>> Back >>> >> > then two quick changes.____ >>> >> > >>> >> > __ __ >>> >> > >>> >> > Note: Square Dancers define Square Thru as finishing in the >>> >> > direction you were facing for the last change, with your back >>> to the >>> >> > person you just passed; Contra Dancers liked the term, but >>> ignored >>> >> > that bit of the definition! Aren’t living traditions >>> wonderful?____ >>> >> > >>> >> > __ __ >>> >> > >>> >> > Of course, since a Balanced “Square Thru” is now a well-defined >>> >> > contra term, an Interrupted one should surely be:____ >>> >> > >>> >> > Pull by Right, give Left Hand & Balance F/B, Pull by Left____ >>> >> > >>> >> > :-)____ >>> >> > >>> >> > __ __ >>> >> > >>> >> > Happy dancing,____ >>> >> > >>> >> > John____ >>> >> > >>> >> > ____ >>> >> > >>> >> > John Sweeney, Dancer, England [email protected] >>> >> > <mailto:[email protected]> 01233 625 362 & 07802 940 574____ >>> >> > >>> >> > http://www.contrafusion.co.uk <http://www.contrafusion.co.uk> >>> for >>> >> > Dancing in Kent____ >>> >> > >>> >> > _______________________________________________ >>> >> > Contra Callers mailing list -- >>> [email protected] >>> >> > <mailto:[email protected]> >>> >> > To unsubscribe send an email to contracallers- >>> >> > [email protected] <mailto:contracallers- >>> >> > [email protected]> >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> > _______________________________________________ >>> >> > Contra Callers mailing list -- [email protected] >>> >> > To unsubscribe send an email to >>> [email protected] >>> >> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >>> >> Contra Callers mailing list -- [email protected] >>> >> To unsubscribe send an email to >>> [email protected] >>> > >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > Contra Callers mailing list -- [email protected] >>> > To unsubscribe send an email to >>> [email protected] >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Contra Callers mailing list -- [email protected] >>> To unsubscribe send an email to >>> [email protected] >>> >> _______________________________________________ > Contra Callers mailing list -- [email protected] > To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected] >
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