I'd like to add, that the Ordinal Property actually needs the concept of
an Ordered Collection in the first place, within which it operates.
And of course a Happy New Year to all of you!
Martin
On 1/7/2019 11:18 AM, Martin Doerr wrote:
Dear All,
On 1/7/2019 8:02 AM, Stephen Stead wrote:
Hi all
Happy New Year
The property name: Perhaps we should borrow from the nomenclature of
ordinal statistics and use
ranked higher than (ranked lower than)
Hi Martin
Excellent questions!
1] Research questions that are enabled:-
I envisaged questions of the form that Athanasios has suggested as
well as the opposite; “Where are examples of “x” object type that
have a condition of “y” or better that I can have access to for
comparative observations”
In the map world I also thought of the integration question “During
the planning of this expedition was there a map at “x” scale or
larger published and available within “y” distance of the expedition
headquarters”. This was the type of question envisaged in the Arctic
Cloud project.
I have the impression that these are indeed the only research
questions at a factual level (about particulars), that are supported
by such a property. The scope of the CRM is deliberately restricted to
this level, in order to maintain a clear modularity against, in
particular, terminological systems. With "broader/narrower" we
maintain a minimal interface to such systems.
The above examples are about inclusion of categories, yet another much
more specialized case of getting something of type x and narrower. In
case of a few qualities, the retrieval problem can easily be solved by
enumeration. The underlying IT system will anyway do nothing else than
expanding the "y" or better. The example also shows that the sense of
the ordering is quite diverse: "better", or "higher resolution" etc.,
are not implied by one general property. each ordered collection will
have different senses.
Any ordered collection can be expanded by a set of ((n-1)**2)/2
"pyramid" of generalizations, which effectively represent the order.
This solution is effective for smaller sorted sets. Map scales may be
a different case, the only one I am currently aware of.
2] Reasons for CRM rather than SKOS:-
As George says we control CRMbase and not SKOS 😊. More substantially
the solution of skos:OrderedCollection does not allow the integration
of different terms from different sources into the same term ordered
collection without physically merging them. While that could be
overcome (it scales like a bag of bolts) the more substantial problem
is it does not allow branching paths through the collection; for
example Excellent > Good > Poor and Excellent > Average > Poor is not
possible. Another concern is that all Collections are automatically
ordered by their position in the implemented list: that is all
collections are ordered even if there is no such ordering in the real
world.
The question of integrating different ordered collections of terms is
definitely out of scope of the CRM, and a question of terminology
mapping, and definitely not solved in any way by such a property.
We cannot solve all the problems of the world. We explicitly recommend
SKOS as complementary, in order to maintain some order between
standardization efforts. We have discussed with the NKOS group for
many years the need to standardized specializations of "related term",
but never could mobilize any larger community to do so. There are some
dozen candidates, and theoretical issues. Picking up now one of the
most specialized, poses a serious methodological question, if we aware
of the scope, relative relevance and further related issues to such a
modelling.
We already have to many open fronts in CRM-SIG. We encounter the
danger not not to control SKOS, but to loose control of the CRM
itself. Anybody can make a local extension to SKOS, and recommend it,
without the SKOS team, exactly as anybody can make a local extension
to the CRM. There may be other models already dealing with the problem.
3] Coverage of problems:-
Collection management: questions of collection morbidity, storage
effectiveness and process validation
Museology: Do different collection management regimes materially
affect the short, medium and long term collection conservation
Material Science: which materials have survived best
Cultural Heritage Geo-informatics: What map scales were available,
when, for what and for/by whom.
Risk Management: What is the current state across institutions. What
is the history of risk classification across the
domain/region/institution type
Audience Research: Many institutions are starting to collect Likert
scale data as part of the feedback on exhibitions. This could then be
linked to exhibition content to gain insight into the affective
museum experience. This is what Erin Canning is working on.
We should not confuse the question of standardizing ordered value sets
with providing a link between the terms. The link does not solve that
at all.
I would argue we are out of scope of CRMbase.
Best,
Martin
Rgds
SdS
Stephen Stead
Tel +44 20 8668 3075
Mob +44 7802 755 013
E-mail ste...@paveprime.com <mailto:ste...@paveprime.com>
LinkedIn Profile https://www.linkedin.com/in/steads/
*From:*Crm-sig <crm-sig-boun...@ics.forth.gr> *On Behalf Of *Martin Doerr
*Sent:* 03 January 2019 17:56
*To:* crm-sig@ics.forth.gr
*Subject:* Re: [Crm-sig] **NEW ISSUE** Ordinal Property for E55 Type
Dear All,
Very nice all that, but the critical question for a concept to enter
CRM base is:
What is the scientific question in an information integration
environment, that needs this property to make the relevant
connection/ inference,
and further:
Why is that proposed for CRM base and not for SKOS?
and finally:
What is the coverage of problems that benefit from this property?
These concerns are part of the methodology we follow, and most
substantial. We must make sure they appear in the "principles".
Best,
Martin
On 1/3/2019 7:32 PM, Stephen Stead wrote:
Excellent then the revised property, scope note and examples
would be:-
*Pxx conceptually follows (conceptually precedes)*
Domain: E55 Type
Range: E55 Type
Quantification: many to many (0,n:0,n)
This property allows instances of E55 Type to be declared as
having an order relative to other instances of E55 Type, without
necessarily having a specific value associated with either
instance. This allows, for example, for an E55 Type instance
representing the concept of "good" to follow the E55 Type
instance representing the concept of "average". This property is
transitive, and thus if "average" follows "poor", then "good"
also follows "poor". In the domain of statistics, types that
participate in this kind of relationship are called "Ordinal
Variables"; as opposed to those without order which are called
"Nominal Variables". This property allows for queries that select
based on the relative position of participating E55 Types.
Examples:
* Good (E55) /conceptually follows/ Average (E55)
* Map Scale 1:10000 (E55) /conceptually follows/ Map Scale
1:20000 (E55)
* Fire Hazard Rating 4 (E55) /conceptually follows/ Fire Hazard
Rating 3 (E55)
How does that seem?
Rgds
SdS
Stephen Stead
Director
Paveprime Ltd
35 Downs Court Rd
Purley, Surrey
UK, CR8 1BF
Tel +44 20 8668 3075
Fax +44 20 8763 1739
Mob +44 7802 755 013
E-mail ste...@paveprime.com <mailto:ste...@paveprime.com>
LinkedIn Profile https://www.linkedin.com/in/steads/
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--
------------------------------------
Dr. Martin Doerr
Honorary Head of the
Center for Cultural Informatics
Information Systems Laboratory
Institute of Computer Science
Foundation for Research and Technology - Hellas (FORTH)
N.Plastira 100, Vassilika Vouton,
GR70013 Heraklion,Crete,Greece
Vox:+30(2810)391625
Email:mar...@ics.forth.gr <mailto:mar...@ics.forth.gr>
Web-site:http://www.ics.forth.gr/isl
--
------------------------------------
Dr. Martin Doerr
Honorary Head of the
Center for Cultural Informatics
Information Systems Laboratory
Institute of Computer Science
Foundation for Research and Technology - Hellas (FORTH)
N.Plastira 100, Vassilika Vouton,
GR70013 Heraklion,Crete,Greece
Vox:+30(2810)391625
Email:mar...@ics.forth.gr
Web-site:http://www.ics.forth.gr/isl
--
------------------------------------
Dr. Martin Doerr
Honorary Head of the
Center for Cultural Informatics
Information Systems Laboratory
Institute of Computer Science
Foundation for Research and Technology - Hellas (FORTH)
N.Plastira 100, Vassilika Vouton,
GR70013 Heraklion,Crete,Greece
Vox:+30(2810)391625
Email: mar...@ics.forth.gr
Web-site: http://www.ics.forth.gr/isl
